LARGE Conical Grinder Owner Club

InspectorGadget

First of all forgive me for rabbiting on a bit about the Robur. It is a tester for me. I love this machine. It is easy to live with and is easy to use. I am not so meticulous as some here are though. I don't clean out the chute with a brush each time and if there are beans left in the hopper overnight they can stay there. I try to grind just enough for each time but if there is some left over during the day for the next shot I don't worry too much. I did do some testing against the Macap M4D. I honestly couldn't tell any difference. I'm sure with some roasts and a better set of taste buts and even more testing that there may be a difference but it definitely isn't huge with my roast which is a medium to dark roast of Ethiopian. It may be with a different roast the results would be different but really I just wanted to find out whether the differences are obvious and big and I don't think they are. The grind quality though is outstanding as far as lightness and zero clumping. The Macap M4D does clump a bit, not a lot but it is there but in the cup it doesn't make any noticeable difference. I used My Wega Mini Nova Classic with the standard portafilter for testing. The Robur will be up for sale if anyone here in Perth is interested. I like it a lot but it is time to go back to the Macap and maybe try another grinder sometime like a Mazzer Major, just to see if I am missing out on anything. If I can get one cheap that is! I have talked to other people on grinders and WOW, the technical discussions on grind size and distribution even down to how you get football shaped particles and lots of fines with conicals... I think the proof is in the cup and if you can tell the difference then that is a positive result, if you can't then it is down to if you like having that particular grinder on your bench. I do but my wife doesn't and I can see her point. The Macap M4D in chrome also fits in with the Mini Nova nicely. Nevertheless when this is sold I will miss seeing it go and it has given me respect for large conincal grinders as home machines.

Simon

InspectorGadget wrote:

First of all forgive me for rabbiting on a bit about the Robur. It is a tester for me. I love this machine. It is easy to live with and is easy to use. I am not so meticulous as some here are though. I don't clean out the chute with a brush each time and if there are beans left in the hopper overnight they can stay there. I try to grind just enough for each time but if there is some left over during the day for the next shot I don't worry too much. I did do some testing against the Macap M4D. I honestly couldn't tell any difference. I'm sure with some roasts and a better set of taste buts and even more testing that there may be a difference but it definitely isn't huge with my roast which is a medium to dark roast of Ethiopian. It may be with a different roast the results would be different but really I just wanted to find out whether the differences are obvious and big and I don't think they are. The grind quality though is outstanding as far as lightness and zero clumping. The Macap M4D does clump a bit, not a lot but it is there but in the cup it doesn't make any noticeable difference. I used My Wega Mini Nova Classic with the standard portafilter for testing. The Robur will be up for sale if anyone here in Perth is interested. I like it a lot but it is time to go back to the Macap and maybe try another grinder sometime like a Mazzer Major, just to see if I am missing out on anything. If I can get one cheap that is! I have talked to other people on grinders and WOW, the technical discussions on grind size and distribution even down to how you get football shaped particles and lots of fines with conicals... I think the proof is in the cup and if you can tell the difference then that is a positive result, if you can't then it is down to if you like having that particular grinder on your bench. I do but my wife doesn't and I can see her point. The Macap M4D in chrome also fits in with the Mini Nova nicely. Nevertheless when this is sold I will miss seeing it go and it has given me respect for large conincal grinders as home machines.

Ah nah I'm loving hearing about it! The Robur is something I don't think I would get, but it's educational hearing about it and its performance. (And that's awesome to hear you're not as meticulous... I honestly wish I wasn't so meticulous!! I tend to try and make sure there are no extra grounds or beans fragment leftover, far too paranoid about it affecting my shots... but I'm AIMING to not be so fastidious!)

InspectorGadget

I might just go ape-shit on this machine and get some Gorilla conical burrs for it. Any thoughts? They're supposed to be the Bongo's bananas with a brinell hardness many times the standard burrs and a low friction coating.

Brett_H

Sounds perfect for a really busy cafe. For home, I reckon you'd be hard-pressed to tell the difference. Perhaps do it when you're up for new burrs and splurge now on awesome browns 😃

InspectorGadget

Hi Brett: I'm not made of money but sometimes things like Gorilla burrs can be resold on especially when used at home, 'one little old lady owner' and so on. They are nearly $500 though and I'm sure you are right but it does fascinate me that they continue to tune the size distribution of the burrs and this is where flavour differences can arise. I remain interested in someone with more money than me and plenty of time on their hands to test these in a Robur

Brett_H

Thing is, and devils advocate.... the tangibility of the 'difference' is purely down to your assessment so perhaps you'd better do it! Now, you know as well as I the psychology of a significant outlay behoves the investor to wax-lyrical about the product on forums like this. The kicker being of course that the waxer is less likely to bemoan a product such as this for fear of looking silly and/or not being able to offload the damn thing to like-minded individuals 😉 Just do it >😃

InspectorGadget

Brett H wrote:

Thing is, and devils advocate.... the tangibility of the 'difference' is purely down to your assessment so perhaps you'd better do it! Now, you know as well as I the psychology of a significant outlay behoves the investor to wax-lyrical about the product on forums like this. The kicker being of course that the waxer is less likely to bemoan a product such as this for fear of looking silly and/or not being able to offload the damn thing to like-minded individuals 😉 Just do it >😃

Ha Brett: You are right so I guess I might just start my glowing report on the Gorilla burrs now, don't bother actually bother buying and testing them. It will contain references to the lack of fines and bitterness and flavour notes so high that they could only otherwise achieved with a rubber band around the 'nads' and so on. Grounds so fluffy that fine snow in siberia doesn't compete and flavours that I didn't know existed in coffee are now blowing my mind. Chocolate notes so pronounced that I may as well be immersed in a vat of the finest swiss chocolate. Floral notes so pronounced it is like being in the middle of the botanic gardens on a fine Spring day and so on. Flavour notes so bright that I need sunglasses when I have an espresso. The burrs a deep black the low friction coefficient so low I need a stethoscope to detect the sounds of the beans being ground. My laser particle analyser (I have a spare one in the shed) will show a such an amazing particle size distribution that in fact is just a simple vertical line. Grant

Simon

InspectorGadget wrote:

Ha Brett: You are right so I guess I might just start my glowing report on the Gorilla burrs now, don't bother actually bother buying and testing them. It will contain references to the lack of fines and bitterness and flavour notes so high that they could only otherwise achieved with a rubber band around the 'nads' and so on. Grounds so fluffy that fine snow in siberia doesn't compete and flavours that I didn't know existed in coffee are now blowing my mind. Chocolate notes so pronounced that I may as well be immersed in a vat of the finest swiss chocolate. Floral notes so pronounced it is like being in the middle of the botanic gardens on a fine Spring day and so on. Flavour notes so bright that I need sunglasses when I have an espresso. The burrs a deep black the low friction coefficient so low I need a stethoscope to detect the sounds of the beans being ground. My laser particle analyser (I have a spare one in the shed) will show a such an amazing particle size distribution that in fact is just a simple vertical line. Grant

HAHAHA another glowing ripper of a post XD

Brett_H

Bwahahahaha :rofl:

InspectorGadget

I'm glad you guys enjoyed my pre-burr review on the Gorilla Gear burrs... The correct and appropriate use of language is important even when used inappropriately..in Blazing Saddles the Movie Hedley Lemarr the assistant to the Governor said to Sheriff Taggart after a spectacularly florid and OTT speech, 'why Mr Lemarr you use your tongue prettier than a $20 whore'. Impressive stuff, modern poetry...suck on that Shakespeare is all I can say. I'm showing my age too. Mazzer Robur burrs have a reputation for taking 20kg and then some of beans to be bed in. It turns out that this was caused by Mazzer producing poorly machined burrs, one engineer in the CoffeeSnobs group took photos of the rough edges and poor finish obvious to even the naked eye. The cause was thought to be equipment that did the cutting being blunt. Evidently Mazzer fixed this....evidently. The corollary of this is that Mazzer burrs are often not the first choice for burrs in the Robur. My Robur has aftermarket burrs fitted by Espresso Works here in Perth and it was for a first line cafe use as their main machine so obviously they did it for reasons other than cost as the difference in cost is not that much, less than $100 maybe even less than $50. I want to replace the burrs just in case even though by my calculations at 20kg per week since January the burrs should still be in good shape and the machine has been not used since July when they started using their Mazzer Kold. There are also burrs called Food Friendly Burrs supposed to last 70% longer. Thoughts?

LeroyC

I think the grass is always greener on the other side. ;-P

InspectorGadget

LeroyC wrote:

I think the grass is always greener on the other side. ;-P

Did you ever replace the burrs in your K10?

LeroyC

InspectorGadget wrote:

Did you ever replace the burrs in your K10?

No, not yet. I have no idea how much use they've had, but the grinder was less than 2yrs old from a relatively low volume cafe when I bought it. I just have to go on appearance and performance and they look sharp and work well so should hopefully last a while yet. New Compak conical burrs are just a tad more expensive than the biggest flat burrs at $240 v $80, so I won't be changing them until necessary.

Koffee_Kosmo

The Mazzer Kold is a different design to the Robur Differences are Robur uses the top burr to adjust grind size Kold uses the bottom burr to adjust grind size Kold does not have a threaded top burr collar The collar is now slip in The reason is due to grinds fowling the collar thread of the Robur making adjustment and cleaning difficult That's why you see an adjustment knob on the side of the Mazzer Kold KK

InspectorGadget

Koffee Kosmo wrote:

The Mazzer Kold is a different design to the Robur Differences are Robur uses the top burr to adjust grind size Kold uses the bottom burr to adjust grind size Kold does not have a threaded top burr collar The collar is now slip in The reason is due to grinds fowling the collar thread of the Robur making adjustment and cleaning difficult That's why you see an adjustment knob on the side of the Mazzer Kold KK

The best feature of the Mazzer Kold is that it means busy cafes are retiring the Mazzer Robur and so I got one quite cheap and it is a really good one.

LeroyC

InspectorGadget wrote:

The best feature of the Mazzer Kold is that it means busy cafes are retiring the Mazzer Robur and so I got one quite cheap and it is a really good one.

LOL, agreed. I won't tell you how much (or should that be how little) I paid for my K10.

InspectorGadget

Well whatever people may have paid for their grinders 8) I think the $1193 isn't a bad buy for a brand new Robur which includes freight and shipping to the colonial outpost of Perth. The grinder is very quiet and it is great being able to just give it four seconds and have a double shot ready, what is not to like about that? I haven't timed it, I just do it by 'eye' and the grind times seem the same as my used one. The shots are fantastic. I'm sure that the burrs may take some time to bed in but it certainly isn't a problem in that they work perfect right now in the present tense. I should wait a while for a full report though on any changes due to the burrs just in case but the peformance of the burrs are at least as good as the used ones in my old Robur and probably better. I was concerned after what I heard about the Mazzer burrs taking a long time to bed it but if that is the case then it isn't a problem and I can look forward to them being even better. I really don't have any complaints. The Robur is the essense of a perfect grinder, stable, robust and absolutely dead simple with the fewest number of parts to go wrong. The only plastic is on the hoppers and the switch. The entire chassis is sold steel with enamel coating and it weighs 28kg.

Koffee_Kosmo

Congratulations 👏 and welcome to the club A Robur is a beauty to behold My preference as you is for the manual One thing I remembered now from the Mazzer Major is that the grinds sweeper needed a mod to do a better job Not sure if the newer Mazzers have addressed it - if not it’s easy to do KK

InspectorGadget

Koffee Kosmo wrote:

Congratulations 👏 and welcome to the club A Robur is a beauty to behold My preference as you is for the manual One thing I remembered now from the Mazzer Major is that the grinds sweeper needed a mod to do a better job Not sure if the newer Mazzers have addressed it - if not it’s easy to do KK

Hi KK: From memory they all have sweeper arms underneath the bottom burr which from when I stripped by 2010 model down had these same arms. This is just a stock image http://www.cafeparts.com/Espresso-Coffee-Grinder-Parts/Mazzer/Robur Look at part 27 this is the sweeper and it seems to sweep well. Yes, it is an industrial work of art to behold and I never would have bought one new had I not got such a good deal. One reason being is that they are just so well built that there is no shortage of Roburs that can be bought second hand that will run for decades out there for sale. All I would do is buy genuine Mazzer burrs and fit them right away unless you have clear evidence that the burrs are quite new and genuine one. Although burrs last for decades in home use, their lifespan is only months in a cafe and they can be damaged also. Yes, I love this machine so quiet and quick and easy to adjust. Grant

Brett_H

InspectorGadget wrote:

Well whatever people may have paid for their grinders 8) I think the $1193 isn't a bad buy for a brand new Robur which includes freight and shipping to the colonial outpost of Perth. The grinder is very quiet and it is great being able to just give it four seconds and have a double shot ready, what is not to like about that? I haven't timed it, I just do it by 'eye' and the grind times seem the same as my used one. The shots are fantastic. I'm sure that the burrs may take some time to bed in but it certainly isn't a problem in that they work perfect right now in the present tense. I should wait a while for a full report though on any changes due to the burrs just in case but the peformance of the burrs are at least as good as the used ones in my old Robur and probably better. I was concerned after what I heard about the Mazzer burrs taking a long time to bed it but if that is the case then it isn't a problem and I can look forward to them being even better. I really don't have any complaints. The Robur is the essense of a perfect grinder, stable, robust and absolutely dead simple with the fewest number of parts to go wrong. The only plastic is on the hoppers and the switch. The entire chassis is sold steel with enamel coating and it weighs 28kg.

Yeah... if you find another one at that price please shoot me a link 😉 Congratulations!!!

« Previous Page Next Page »