Breville's Marketing and Distribution

System

on 1310248348:

FACT: Breville do not have Company Reps, only direct employees.

Thanks Phil for pointing that out...  

But then again; it stands to reason that a Company Rep is a direct employee otherwise how can they be a Company Rep ?   Me an old age again and stating the obvious or is that Tautology.

However; that statement of mine as quoted below must then be incorrect..

on 1310172692:

FACT: What is known to the general population is that other than a brief viewing,  the only people who have had them for a while are those that are company reps or direct employees.

Should it be Corrected to:

FACT: What is known to the general population is that other than a brief viewing,  the only people who have had them for a time to play with; are those that are  direct employees OR  from a select  couple of speciality coffee retailers.


If other's have reviewed OR the revised statement is incorrect, then please feel free to correct.  


Anger On  "Always looking for the Truth"  and UM is without honour.

mcknightp

on 1310347238:

Seems to me the Breville extended pre release advertising campaign (started mid May I think) has well and truly polarised coffee communities here and overseas. Using the internet via forums was an interesting (if somewhat hazardous) exercise in gaining cheap publicity, as the company has discovered trying to control forum members is a little like trying to herd cats, all very unpredictable, I suspect next time they have a product to pre release they may well go down the conventional media path and leave forum members to guess and second guess to their hearts content. As a company employee you cant get into slanging matches with potential customers and expect to come out on top, it simply ain't going to happen. What will be the outcome of all of this hype? I suspect the early adopters had made up their mind from day one and will be waiting at the retailers door on release day with plastic in hand. The coffee purists of course wouldn't be seen dead with a Breville appliance gracing their bench. What we need to keep in mind is it's only a coffee maker and not a life saving piece of medical equipment, the whole deal really is a bit of a storm in a tea cup. Regardless, I predict the likes of Hardly Normal will have some ripping deals on this appliance in their post Christmas sales this year ::)

Firstly I'd like to say that Breville has never set out to "control forum members" as you put it. All we've done right from the start is give coffee forum members information on the machine that's being released. "The coffee purists of course wouldn't be seen dead with a Breville appliance gracing their bench." Ask Scottie Callaghan what he has on his bench at home. A Breville BES860 Fresca, that he paid for! I assume you know who Scottie is?

mcknightp

on 1310298403:

Thanks Phil for pointing that out...   But then again; it stands to reason that a Company Rep is a direct employee otherwise how can they be a Company Rep ?   Me an old age again and stating the obvious or is that Tautology. However; that statement of mine as quoted below must then be incorrect.. Should it be Corrected to: FACT: What is known to the general population is that other than a brief viewing,  the only people who have had them for a time to play with; are those that are  direct employees OR  from a select  couple of speciality coffee retailers. If other's have reviewed OR the revised statement is incorrect, then please feel free to correct.   Anger On  "Always looking for the Truth"  and UM is without honour.

You were the one who made the distinction between rep & employee like they were somehow different, so I just needed to clarify it for you. And no, you are wrong again. There have been several people & businesses who have had Dual Boilers to play with, assess & review.

beanflying

::) Please Phil what the people you use as technical "consultants" use at home is relevant but their independence is within our place to question if you want to use them as a reference point. Breville have produced some good espresso based products over time and some that were below par. Splitting this stuff off into its own 'Industry' thread I think as it has nothing to do with the machine the thread is about discussing.

Dry_bean.

on 1310365072:

Firstly I'd like to say that Breville has never set out to "control forum members" as you put it. All we've done right from the start is give coffee forum members information on the machine that's being released. "The coffee purists of course wouldn't be seen dead with a Breville appliance gracing their bench." Ask Scottie Callaghan what he has on his bench at home. A Breville BES860 Fresca, that he paid for! I assume you know who Scottie is?

On reading this the first quote that sprang to mind was from

E61

on 1310365072:

Firstly I'd like to say that Breville has never set out to "control forum members" as you put it. All we've done right from the start is give coffee forum members information on the machine that's being released.

Phil, a lot of people, including the many who have contacted me directly, those who have posted here and those who posted on a thread somewhere else, which was deemed too sensitive and subsequently deleted, feel very let down. Breville gleaned a huge amount of free market research and input from people who are traditionally customers of specialty coffee retailers. People who, quite rightly, felt that they would benefit from their participation and from the stronger competition found between independent and specialty coffee retailers. To not make any stock available to independent retailers was insulting and please don

mcknightp

on 1310365937:

::) Please Phil what the people you use as technical "consultants" use at home is relevant but their independence is within our place to question if you want to use them as a reference point. Breville have produced some good espresso based products over time and some that were below par. Splitting this stuff off into its own 'Industry' thread I think as it has nothing to do with the machine the thread is about discussing.

I didn't say Scottie Callaghan is a technical consultant to Breville, because he isn't. Where have we ever said every espresso machine we have produced is good? You guys clearly don't like it when the debate is not going your way! Why not delete this post or move it to another bottom of the pile thread?

beanflying

Phil, if you want to see your product discussion full of this sort of thing we could oblige but any eventual actual discussion on it will be clouded by this sort of discussion that has little to do with the operation,use of the machine which I happen to quite like with some reservations. Quoting Mark Prince here " Breville also consulted with other notable espresso experts in Australia, including two former Australian barista champs, Scottie Callaghan and Hazel de los Reyes during the project." So perhaps you might like to get him to retract this statement if it is incorrect. regards Tim

WotB

Seriously, why would you hype it up to the target market, and then only offer it in places where you know the target market wouldn't even waste their time buying from?  The only other places getting the first run of stock are "buddies," which quite frankly, reeks of nepotism.  Funny how these same people only a short time ago were rubbishing your brand and everything coming out of China.  My how times have changed. I don't care if it spits out unicorn tears, or creates double rainbows when switched on, the practices are abominable.

Muscles

And the two specialty stores that do have access to the first run of BDB's were quick to drop the Breville Smart Grinders at the first sniff of competition/discounting. I wonder now if they only started selling them again once they'd heard of the arrival of the BDB. Also of note, both of those stores ramped their prices back up as soon as Breville told Matt of E61 that he would not be getting stock. Coincidence? I think not...

shape_shifter

Muscles that doesn't surprise me in the slightest. Isn't at least TC a Pty Ltd?  That would say to me the ACCC would be very interested in price collusion. I've been doing some research of my own in light of what someone posted about them and products made in China, yep definitely came up with sly comments that they weren't any good and geez they were all over Breville like a rash.

hiphipharar

I don't know about others but I am totally over this whole Breville thing. I think it is time everyone shuts up about it and waits for the launch day. It was good when Sunbeam took the extra step of consulting industry specialists to improve the design of its coffee equipment; it is good that Breville has done the same and gone the extra mile...errr...kilometre. Once launched, I look forward to the positive reviews of a bit of Aussie  enginuity (and that's something we don't hear enough of these days). Yes some of you have been disappointed by the marketing decisions made leading up to launch. I'm no retail expert but I imagine the term 'supply contracts' apply. Breville would not be at liberty to disclose the terms of these. One thing I feel pretty confident about is that the BES900 will be a big success and there will be eventually enough machines for all who want one It disappoints me that there now appears to be two competing camps among Australian coffee forums: this one and CoffeeSnobs There is enough room for both and I don't think either should be used to launch attacks on the other. Now let's sit back with a good cup of coffee and wait for the big day to arrive. Let's not spoil the party (FWIW, I have no interest in,  nor intention to buy a BES900. I'm just sick of too much toing and froing about it these days)

David Gubbin

"Hip hip huray", hiphiphuray. To clear up a small thing, the machine IS available at other coffee specialists from launch (outside of the 2 that have been referred to). But it's there call where and how they market it. They are not members of this forum. They are bundling training and grinders and other stuff off their own back. They have worked with us over the past 3 months and have an account with us and were programmed into the first shipment early. And again, other specialists and many more traditional retailers have been asked to wait until we can supply them.  As much as I'd like 2000 here on Aug 1st, it just isn't happening. The rabbit just isn't in the hat! Thanks for everyones patience, we've really got to get back to ensuring we get 1st production across the line. Dave, the Breville marketing guy.

Vinitasse

on 1310365072:

"The coffee purists of course wouldn't be seen dead with a Breville appliance gracing their bench." Ask Scottie Callaghan what he has on his bench at home. A Breville BES860 Fresca, that he paid for! I assume you know who Scottie is?

I heard from Scottie today and thought a bit of clarity might be warranted... and possibly even worth a giggle or two. "Too funny! That's a big compliment that people would be concerned about whether I owned a Breville 860 or not. I don't know what the 860 is but I have done a little consulting work for Breville over the last 2 years. They just wanted my opinion on some things. And they have given me 2 Breville Fresca Home Espresso machines which I gave away. I currently don't own a home espresso machine because I prefer to make myself a pour over at home. Cheers Scottie"

Dry_bean.

on 1310536245:

I heard from Scottie today and thought a bit of clarity might be warranted... and possibly even worth a giggle or two. "Too funny! That's a big compliment that people would be concerned about whether I owned a Breville 860 or not. I don't know what the 860 is but I have done a little consulting work for Breville over the last 2 years. They just wanted my opinion on some things. And they have given me 2 Breville Fresca Home Espresso machines which I gave away. I currently don't own a home espresso machine because I prefer to make myself a pour over at home. Cheers Scottie"

Ha. ;D

Koffee_Kosmo

on 1310536245:

I heard from Scottie today and thought a bit of clarity might be warranted... and possibly even worth a giggle or two. "Too funny! That's a big compliment that people would be concerned about whether I owned a Breville 860 or not. I don't know what the 860 is but I have done a little consulting work for Breville over the last 2 years. They just wanted my opinion on some things. And they have given me 2 Breville Fresca Home Espresso machines which I gave away. I currently don't own a home espresso machine because I prefer to make myself a pour over at home. Cheers Scottie"

That and my correlation  to the famous slogan has a bearing to my post " The simple things in life are always the best " I was quite happy making Greek/Turkish style coffee until the upgrade bug hit My upgrade has surpassed the in between stage in both brewing & grinding machines, and dont forget  roasting Does that make me a tragic KK

David Gubbin

FYI it's wrong (and illegal) of me to go into pricing discussions, OBVIOUSLY, but the 3 specialists that we have had discussions with were offered a sweetner for pre release orders, to continue hype through launch.  The goal to hit the ground running with what we hope will be positive reviews from early adopters. This is not unusual. That offer has now and was always designed to be expired. Collusion, NO, businesses discussing strategies to drive future business, YES. What they sell for, what they bundle with, what HN sell for, what tGG's sell for is absolutely out of our control and up to them. Always was and always will be. The OTHER specialistS who wanted first shipment stock, did not have that discussion with me, but the door was always open to that discussion if they wanted to have it. We have not knocked on one door to push this into specialists, the interest has been driven from them.  And noone has been refused! And to be approached for stock last week was just too late in the game to capture what limited opening stock there is likely to be. And like ALL others specialists or most traditional retailers, they've been asked to wait. On the Scottie thing. We're having a chuckle about that too and am not willing to get into a "quoting debate". Dave the Breville marketing guy.

E61

on 1310544309:

The OTHER specialistS who wanted first shipment stock, did not have that discussion with me, but the door was always open to that discussion if they wanted to have it. We have not knocked on one door to push this into specialists, the interest has been driven from them.  And noone has been refused! And to be approached for stock last week was just too late in the game to capture what limited opening stock there is likely to be. And like ALL others specialists or most traditional retailers, they've been asked to wait.

David, I'm trying VERY hard not to add more fuel to this issue, but every time you or Phil imply that I was "just too late" ordering or was included in discussions just makes me more determined to  clarify the facts. I don

David Gubbin

Matt, I'll vouch for most of what you've written in the last post and wish you and I had spoken earlier on in this process. And wish we'd had a chance to discuss this over the weekend as an offer to get a better  understanding of our initial discussion. Yes, we knew of your interest, as with many many others. But yes we're dealing with loaves and fishes with initial shipments. Much less than planned. Unfortunately! And unfortunately it is a daily moving target, hence my inability to offer anyone firm dates. And also hence my comment that October is a safe time (worst estimate i hope) for a far wider distribution of the product. It's NOT a soft launch by design. But it is by consequence. And yes, we do have to offer some priority to what's available to those whom have accounts with us and particularly key accounts as expected I'm sure. I also agree that  it was safe for you to assume that it was going to be very tough for you to service your leads quickly given our situation. But we never closed the door on future supply, regardless of price, bundling whatever and I don't think you're suggesting we did. In terms of our involvement with forums, that's the forums call. From the get go we've been congratulated by our involvement and castigated by our involvement. If the forum does not want the brand outwardly represented here, then that's the forums call. Not ours. D tBmg

DoubleRistretto

on 1310536245:

I heard from Scottie today and thought a bit of clarity might be warranted... and possibly even worth a giggle or two. "Too funny! That's a big compliment that people would be concerned about whether I owned a Breville 860 or not. I don't know what the 860 is but I have done a little consulting work for Breville over the last 2 years. They just wanted my opinion on some things. And they have given me 2 Breville Fresca Home Espresso machines which I gave away. I currently don't own a home espresso machine because I prefer to make myself a pour over at home. Cheers Scottie"

ROFLMAO  :D :o

shape_shifter

I know this is not Breville related but it has come about because of the Breville saga... ...I've found my coffee journey waning, even to the point of not wanting to make myself a coffee or roasting.  It's become a chore instead of being the total joy I once got from roasting, grinding, preparing and drinking my coffees. Someone please tell me this will end one day  I did get a laugh out of Scotties comments

Brett H

on 1310558284:

I know this is not Breville related but it has come about because of the Breville saga... ...I've found my coffee journey waning, even to the point of not wanting to make myself a coffee or roasting.  It's become a chore instead of being the total joy I once got from roasting, grinding, preparing and drinking my coffees. Someone please tell me this will end one day  I did get a laugh out of Scotties comments

It will end and inspiration will return.  For someone with a radically and ingeniously modified popper I don't know that this is the Chinese solution to your desires anyhow.  Do yourself a favour SS and look beyond this to the Lelit PID just as a starting point. They look like great machines and the forum threads on them haven't been soured. Is there a thread for this machine on the net that hasn't suffered from controversy and angst? Avoid!

beanflying

on 1310558284:

I know this is not Breville related but it has come about because of the Breville saga... ...I've found my coffee journey waning, even to the point of not wanting to make myself a coffee or roasting.  It's become a chore instead of being the total joy I once got from roasting, grinding, preparing and drinking my coffees. Someone please tell me this will end one day   I did get a laugh out of Scotties comments

With you there too. I think we all have a fair idea of how this has transpired so short of trawling back over the same ground there isn't much more to be gained by further discussion. Lack of stock is disappointing for all sides including us customers. Turn the mad electronic skills and energy into a double boiler Silvia/Lelit hybrid build maybe  

SniffCoffee

on 1310558284:

...I've found my coffee journey waning, even to the point of not wanting to make myself a coffee or roasting.  It's become a chore instead of being the total joy I once got from roasting, grinding, preparing and drinking my coffees. Someone please tell me this will end one day 

Shapeshifter let me share my experience this week. I was away in Perth last week so didn't get a chance to roast anything.  Yesterday morning the last of the last batch was used up, so this morning I had to resort to opening a 'brick' of pre-ground roasted coffee. The pour was horrid.  The crema was pathetic.  It was almost white.  The taste....well, a lot of milk helped...the smell...yeech. So my solution for you is:  have a cup of instant.  You'll be back at the roaster in minutes! Sniff

UNM

Sniff said: So my solution for you is: have a cup of inst be back at the roaster in minute Or alternatively, just accept that you are over all this upgraditis and messing around with home roasting. Pick up some good beans from a local roaster, a simple pourover (the choice of champions) and enjoy. As for Breville marketing, I remain impressed by how well the pre launch of the BDB has gone. Many coffee geeks/snobs/tragics know a lot about the product, are emotionally engaged and some have even bought one, despite it not yet being available. I don't recall anyone from Breville ever saying that the BDB would be made available to specialist retailers first, in fact throughout the process, it seemed like this was a product which was intended to be sold by volume retailers and still provide a good user experience (e.g. Factory testing, warranty support, usability). The only time I remember being told that  specialist retailers had any kind of early access was by one of the retailers themselves, who said that my local appliance shop wont have one until well after they do, which surprised me slightly at the time. This now appears to be wishful thinking on their part. I am glad the folks from Breville have chosen to participate in this forum and hope they hang around post launch when things get really interesting.

Rider

on 1310577366:

WTF... This is a Breville marketing thread and not AM's FB wall  :D

;D  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D 5 stars dude...

SniffCoffee

Heck, we should all be able to get it on the frequent flyer store in a few months...

Rider

on 1311047724:

Any one want a BES 900 and Coffee Beans and a Smart Grinder and a Barista Training session... AND your in Queensland, drop me a PM  ;D

Ooh, you got one to play with... Looking forward to your report, just out of curiosity  :D

grahamh

And the two specialty stores that do have access to the first run of BDB's were quick to drop the Breville Smart Grinders at the first sniff of competition/discounting. I wonder now if they only started selling them again once they'd heard of the arrival of the BDB.

Brett H

on 1311059714:

And the two specialty stores that do have access to the first run of BDB's were quick to drop the Breville Smart Grinders at the first sniff of competition/discounting. I wonder now if they only started selling them again once they'd heard of the arrival of the BDB. Maybe they read there own misleading and deceptive threads on snobs, and believed it

LOL!  ;D. If I were in the market for this level of machinery I wouldn't buy anything without checking out the Lelit PID and the Vario.  Now there's a killer home combo for about the same price and no distribution worries/waiting... just saying 

shape_shifter

Brett that is exactly and I mean exactly where I was going and depending on other things still might. I've spoken to Richard who has highlighted some issues to me and I'm waiting to see after Charlie has had a play with it for a little bit to see if they are still issues. The other issue is my OH, he wants a button to press so he doesn't have to work it out for himself, he might have to deal with it  ;D