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Programed Vs Manual?

ARCARC
edited January 1970 in Espresso Machines
I've just got a programmable Bezzera, 2 group machine. I've always only used manual machines where there is one button for shower flow, shower flow off. This new machine I've inherited lets you program how much water flow, my only concern is once the pump has circulated the set amount of water (say 30ml for example), will there still be enough pressure to push the water through the packed group head or do you have to set it to push more than 30ml for a single shot? I'm old school, I like to watch the colour and flow and turn off the shower at the right second - not sure about this programming business.... Thoughts?
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Comments

  • Koffee_KosmoKoffee_Kosmo
    Thats the same as my BZ40 The middle button is a manual ON/OFF See photo KK
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  • askthecoffeeguyaskthecoffeeguy
    The idea is to load your basket with coffee and run the shot in program mode - stopping it when you reach desired extraction levels Personally I'm all for programming as long as it's set up correctly and monitored over time to make improvements / revisions as necessary, as different staff members all have their own take on correct extraction levels I've also watched some of melbourne's so called finer cafes churning out coffee when it's busy, using manual methods, and seen different amounts of coffee end up in each glass after the crema has settled, leading potentially to a different result each time Preprogrammed extractions are a god send in my opinion, but have to be monitored regularly to allow for the effect of seasonal humidity etc Hope this helps Pat
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  • askthecoffeeguyaskthecoffeeguy
    Course for home use it's a different story there's no excuse for not getting manual extraction right if youre in the comfort of your own home, with the time and peace of mind to be on top of all the variables !
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  • FreshCoffee2FreshCoffee2
    on 1311421961:
    The idea is to load your basket with coffee and run the shot in program mode - stopping it when you reach desired extraction levels ....Personally I'm all for programming as long as.....I've also watched some of melbourne's so called finer cafes churning out coffee when it's busy, using manual methods.....leading potentially to a different result each time Preprogrammed extractions are a god send in my opinion, but have to be monitored regularly.........Pat
    Excellent post and I'm with you Pat. There is so much rubbish written in forums trying to convince people not to buy electronically programmable machines as if they are some kind of bad coffee quality monster, when all they do is offer the operator a programmable cup level....which CAN be instantly overridden and stopped early or for that matter any time the operator wants to , if he changes his mind about the pre programmed level. They are a god send in a busy environment, and if home owners want one, then I cant see any reason why not. Rgdz, Attilio very first Crema site sponsor
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  • RichardMRichardM
    For a long time, I would have argued against having a programmed machine at home...however after a while, I started timing my shots, and trying to just adjust around that timing. While I don't (always) do that anymore, I think having a timed/volumetric machine would very much help with consistency, especially when doing a lot of coffees. I certainly wouldn't factor in whether a machine was programmed or not into my next purchase, but if it were programmable, I'd definitely use it.
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  • WotBWotB
    In a home environment, you use whatever you feel like.  I daresay the volumetric function on a machine for me would be just to automate the cooling flush.  We get so focussed on controlling this variable or doing things this way or that (insert technique name here), that we lose sight of what matters most, the stuff coming out of the machine and into the cup. In the end, listen to yourself because you're the one using it.
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  • Koffee_KosmoKoffee_Kosmo
    As far as I know in volumetric machines There is always a manual button - its simply ON/OFF The remaining programmable buttons can be set to your style of coffee based on volume of water that is required As noted in the above posts While the machine is in active mode during a programmed shot, one is able to stop the shot at any time prior to the cycles end, by simply pressing the same button In simple terms, while the espresso machine is in operation during a programmed shot, pressing the button again over-rides the program and shuts it down  KK
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  • askthecoffeeguyaskthecoffeeguy
    Very true - and if I want a longer / stronger extraction I fine my grind, updose the shot, manually preinfuse the puck with a simple on/off function, then run the preprogrammed shot as per usual.  Works great for my takeaway coffees where I'm looking to slightly increase my coffee volume in the cup, and for stronger 'dine in' coffees I also use manual preinfusion for my decaf coffee to add moisture to the puck before running the shot - works a treat every time!
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  • FreshCoffee2FreshCoffee2
    Apologies if you already know this Pat, but I guess there will be others that dont. If that technique works for you then by all means continue to do so but did you know that a "manual pre infusion" using the manual group switch does not duplicate pre infusion as programmed in electronic machines? Electronically controlled pre infusion doesn't activate the  exhaust / depressurisation of the puck in mid cycle when the flow stops and leaves the preinfused oils in there to continue with the brew when the flow restarts. On the other hand when an operator "pre infuses" by activating the group on/off toggle switch manually, the exhaust / depressurisation cycle of the solenoid valve is activated. That is, much of the disolved oil that you are trying to increase and keep in the pre-infusion, is spat out the exhaust when you stop the group flow the first time,  instead of staying in the puck until you restart the group. It cant hurt to do it "manually", but it does not have the same effect as allowing the preset electronics to do it for you by normal use of the touchpad. E61 type groups (whether they be the short manual lever type OR the modern solenoid operated derivative),  have a manual pre infusion valve built in to the group that always activates whether an operator tries to do it manually or not, and operators  are better served to just activate the group normally as pre infusion is happening regardless. Hope that helps.   Rgdz, Attilio very first Crema site sponsor
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  • ARCARC
    appreciate everyones thoughts, all very true - the programmable buttons can be manually overiden at any time and the machine does have a shower  flow on/off switch aswell so you can still run it manually if you choose. I guess the trap in a retail environment is for lazy staff to trust the button sometimes instead of the quality of the shot being produced, but certainly for busy periods I imagine will be profoundly useful.
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