Londinium I Lever Espresso Machine

Lacehim

Nice Reiss. So will I still be able to get one before Christmas? ;D Also as Beanz noted you've started getting ready for their release on your website. Is it possible to have more details about the different models (ie the colours etc) so that I can choose one before release. I don't want to miss out mate! I need a new machine yesterday! 😉 Do you need any testers? 😃 :laugh: 😉 It's all looking very exciting. I've decided to give it a go with the 2400w element, and hope it all works. I figured if my kettle (with 2000w element) didn't cause issues, then it should be ok. Cheers

lespresso

the colours are listed on our website. tomorrow i hope to button these down by referencing the RAL colour, along with some negotiation with Fracino as i doubt they have access to every powder on the colour chart we may not offer every colour in the first run, in the interests of making it a bit easier to manage i hope that by about this time next week we will have completed LONDINIUM I machines, including the Luxe edition, with images taken with an 85mm SLR lens or thereabouts so there should be a lot less distortion, and you should get a better idea of the proportions - it is deeper, wider, and lower than it appears in any of the images that have been published to date we will not take orders until we have every part in our possession, and we will be regulating it very carefully so we don't take more orders than we have machines

Lwowiak

Lacehim, Will you keep your PV for a while after the L1 arrives? It would be interesting to see what differences you detect in the cup. :stir Comparing espresso from both machines would be a very interesting exercise, if you have the time of course. 😉

Lacehim

lespresso wrote:

we will not take orders until we have every part in our possession, and we will be regulating it very carefully so we don't take more orders than we have machines

Sounds good, just make sure I don't miss out! 😉 I'm most interested in the Luxe edition. After seeing Borat's shiny boiler I just know it's the one for me and it's something different that stands out from the s/s crowd. http://www.bestcafes.com.au/forum/projects-rebuilds/lever-project-urania-1-group/msg21775/#msg21775 Any chance you'll have a nakid handle to buy too???

Lwowiak wrote:

Will you keep your PV for a while after the L1 arrives? It would be interesting to see what differences you detect in the cup. :stir Comparing espresso from both machines would be a very interesting exercise, if you have the time of course. 😉

I won't be keeping it forever, but yes there will be a change over period. I'll have to invite Kelsey (or anyone else interested) over for a taste/feel comparison. The lusso is a great machine. I was pretty gutted when the Bosco came up so cheap (your a lucky bunny mate) and I'm hoping this fills the void! 😉

Kelsey

I'll be there!

Beanz

Hi Reiss Great to see the Londinium prototype getting closer to the final production model. I was wondering if you could add some information regarding the water tank. Is it fixed or can it easily be removed for cleaning like the tank in the Giotto ? Is the top of the tank open or is it a narrow opening at the top for filling ? Just considering filling logistics in the space I have available. I recall when I was looking at machines in the past some gave excellent access and others were rather fiddly to fill. I note that it appears the on/off switch is in close proximity to hot parts of the machine. Is this the final location or just the position on the prototype ? If final location was there a specific reason it was located in this position ?

Lacehim

Beanz wrote:

I note that it appears the on/off switch is in close proximity to hot parts of the machine. Is this the final location or just the position on the prototype ? If final location was there a specific reason it was located in this position ?

Well spotted. Looks like it will be between the steam tap and the group. Might be a bit ouchy when it's all warmed up!

lespresso

hi beanz water tank - its remarkably similar to that found on the other Fracino machines 🙂 you can see the lid on the top of the machine - you just lift that up and you can pull the whole tank out to fill it away from the machine the switch gets warm where it is, but not hot it will be tested for surface temperature safety compliance, but at the moment I don't see it will need to be relocated the specific reason is there is very little room on the other side of the panel, once you consider that you want the switch as high as possible on the panel to keep it out of the water and steam, and you want it out of the way so you don't flick it off whilst using the machine, and you want it on the front face so the group protects it from damage whilst in transit reiss.

conikal

Reiss, I dont like to criticize such a impressive project, but... Those shiny slotted flat drip tray covers look nice in the showroom but dont work well in practice. Water falling on them will splash around and also sit on the surface ( so you need to wipe the base of all cups after removing from the cover) , they stain with coffee, and look a mess once they have a few cup scratches. Fine mesh / grid stainless is much more functional and doesnt show the scratches.

lespresso

i don't have a problem with that kind of criticism at all - its very constructive i dont necessarily disagree with you either, but let's see obviously a fabricated wire grill is the most practical, but I'm not that keen on the look and they tend to vibrate and rattle because the height of the feet are never quite the same - which drives me mad im not in favour of mesh, underneath the spot welding looks poor and the fine mesh tends to sag with repeated use punch plate stainless is done elsewhere and i think we need to bring our own look to the table the great thing about stainless plate is you can stick a buffing wheel on a drill, get some metal polish, and restore it to factory condition fairly easily but i don't deny that you have a valid point

Lacehim

lespresso wrote:

the switch gets warm where it is, but not hot it will be tested for surface temperature safety compliance, but at the moment I don't see it will need to be relocated

I wasn't worried about the switch, more about me putting my hand between a hot group, and a hot steam tap to turn the machine off after making a coffee. 😉 (Edit: said handle, should have been hand. Doh!) I've had a number of machines with switches near the bottom and I've never had an electrical issue, or problem due to water/steam being in that area. Just saying.

conikal wrote:

Those shiny slotted flat drip tray covers look nice in the showroom but dont work well in practice.

Being different is okay, but being different for the sake of being different isn't always the right way. The lusso has the most useless drip tray ever. It has holes, but nothing goes into them because it sits on the top and pools. If the Londinium is going to have a 1.5lt drip tray, it needs to function, and stay looking nice. I don't want to be buffing it to make it look nice.

lespresso

not sure i agree with the first bit i agree with the second bit. what i am saying above is that a good point has been raised and I will go away and digest it.

SniffCoffee

Reiss Another question for you. If, after the boiler has come to pressure, you don't give the lever a quick pull to start the thermosiphon (and then wait 7-8 minutes), how long will it take for the thermosiphon to get going? The question is based purely on laziness. I like my machines on a timer so that I can get up and pull a shot straightaway and get my fix immediately, rather than having to wait for the group to stabilize. Sniff

lespresso

sniff - an hour as soon as you have boiler pressure you need to kick start the siphon, as unlike on a dipper where the group is warmed by conduction by being bolted directly to the boiler, on a thermosiphon the group is effectively sitting outside in the cold, if you like i.e. there is no direct contact between the group and the boiler with a thermosiphon when you initiate the thermosiphon from cold it is working flat tack because the hot side - cold side differential is at its maximum, until the group gets up to temp and the temp of the water returning to the group warms up as less heat has been sucked out of it as the group is warmer, reducing the hot side - cold side differential and so the rate of flow slows reiss

conikal

lespresso wrote:

as soon as you have boiler pressure you need to kick start the siphon, reiss

?? why is this necessary ?. other thermosiphon heated groups..lever or E61.. the siphon starts itself ??

lespresso

conikal the thermosiphon will start flowing by itself if you're not in a hurry, but you won't have this big group up to operating temp in 10-11 minutes from switch on unless you initiate it as soon as you have the boiler pressure to do so i don't think that is any different from the others is it? reiss.

Lacehim

Would there be any issues pulling the lever when cold to activate the thermosyphon?. I was always told not to pull on the lever until it was properly warned up. If the seals are cold they could get damaged or wear prematurely. Also out of interest how are the group seals changed? Is it a big job? The lusso group needs a tool to do it quickly so you have to stuff about with clamps and the like.

lespresso

a fair question - when you put the seals in you lube the seals & bore with a food grade silicone lube, so the seals are pretty well protected - they are not being drawn across bare metal changing the seals is a piece of you know what - 4 machine screws (hex/allen heads) & you're in just pull the the whole top half of the group gently upwards, give it a gentle twist if you need to, but you shouldn't have to the whole assembly slides out of the bore in one piece you can also gently push the shower screen off the bottom from the inside and replace the seal that holds it in place - also very easy take note of which way the open side of the seals face, and off you go - 20 minutes and you will have it all back together ensure the seals and all the running surfaces have a very thin film of silicone grease over them shouldn't be required more than every 3 years as an estimate no special tools required

lespresso

The groups finally arrived today, along with the water taps So we stopped twiddling our thumbs and made up a couple of machines Here's the Luxe edition http://londiniumespresso.com/blogs/londinium-espresso-blog/6714510-londinium-i-luxe-edition-first-images Solid wooden grips will be with us on monday Grate for drip tray still needs to be look at following previous concerns raised on this blog

SniffCoffee

Looking fantastic Reiss!! When you're looking at modifying the drip tray grill, is there any way you could make it so that the grill could be flipped so that when flipped it lowers to allow bigger cups under the group? James/Sniff

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