naked pf

Reschsmooth

Back on the subject - I received my chopped pf today (54ml) and am keen to fire it up tonight. I will let you all know tomorrow. HOwever, I am a little concerned as I haven't been getting good extractions from teh current blend I am using - it either gushes out or burns, despite adjusting my dose/tamp/grind. I will hopefully get other beans tomorrow that I am more used to. (Unfortunately, I haven't had the time of late for home roasting). Cheerio P

Reschsmooth

So, naked pf's are very messy! :o At least now I know what channeling really is - almost getting shots of coffee in the eye. Today, I am hoping to get some more beans of a blend I know I can pull good shots frequently (FC, I didn't want to use the 'consistency' word) and will see how I go there. Cheerio P

mattyj

Hey patrick, I've only used a naked a couple of times, but I've noticed that when I used one on saturday I didn't get any channelling. I've been working heaps on my distribution technique, and I think this has been the answer. If you go to coffeegeek.com, search the forums for 'stockfleths move', which is a distribution technique that a lot of the nordic barista's use - the guys from the stockfleths cafes - the ones that tend to win all the world championships... It's helped a lot! Once you've downloaded the short video, it's helpful to read the discussion thread to understand exactly what they're doing ... and when you can do it, you feel like a real rock-star barista! I'm still pretty slow at it though ... edit: on second thoughts, try these two links: http://www.coffeegeek.com/forums/espresso/general/78954, & http://www.coffeegeek.com/forums/espresso/general/139573?LastView=1126827616&Page=1.

Reschsmooth

Matty, I have tried watching the vid but it doesn't run - it just seems to stop immediately after starting. Cheers P

mattyj

hmm ... I'm not all that good with computers. Try this guys page - http://gauperaa.blogspot.com/, and scroll down a bit, look on the left side of the page, under 'blog highlights', you'll see it there. Maybe right click, save as, then watch it... And it's a windows movie thingy, so I think it needs to be played on windows media player.

Reschsmooth

Alright Matt The file doesn't want to play - it starts for about 0.3567592 seconds and then stops. You now have the job of concisely and logically describing the process! (of course, if you feel up to it) P

BeanCounter

G'day Patrick, It's a 2MB file and runs for 55 seconds. I just downloaded it from http://gauperaa.blogspot.com/ and it's OK, so you either have a corrupt file or mutant Media Player. The basic process is to dose until the coffee mounds slightly over the top of the pf. Next step is to fill the edges with coffee by holding your thumb and index finger in an 'L' shape and running your hand around the rim of the pf with your index finger and thumb levelling the coffee whilst leaving a small mound in the centre. Middle finger must be running around the curve of the pf. Next step is to sweep the coffee north then south then north (or was that east-west-east, or ...), then sweep off the excess. Tim then tamps, taps the side, tamps and twists and cleans any coffee off the lugs. The whole process takes around 15 seconds. Regards, Gary

Reschsmooth

Thanks Gary I don't know why, but it ain't working. I think I understand the technique and will give it a go. Cheers P

mattyj

A tip is to run the tip of your thumb around the edges of the portafilter, so that the 'webbing' between your thumb and finger pushes the coffee arund the edges of the basket. You do 2-3 circular motions around the basket, so even everything out. I don't always do the N-S-N thing, I just scrape off the resulting little mound with my finger, and the results seem pretty good!

Reschsmooth

I tried the technique (or how I understood it) last night. The pour still seems to be coming out of the front right side of the basket, with a bit of channelling. However, I concede that I will need to practice the technique more. I tell you what, though, the pf gets damn hot. P

mattyj

that could be a puck density thing - in that the puck has more coffee/is more tightly packed in (even if the surface appears level) at one side than the other. You may already do this, but I've also found that when you're clicking the doser lever, rotate the pf a bit ... like two clicks normal, turn 90^o to the right, two clicks, 180^o to the left, two clicks ... I don't know how the Macap doser performs, but the mazzer tends to throw grinds to the left side of the filter, leading to a denser left side of the puck.

Remus

i would suspect that everyone who starts using a pf will all of a sudden pay much more attention to channeling cos thats the only time it becomes so obvious. as i'm dosing in the pf, i'm constantly tapping the pf against the grinder as its dosing to even out the coffee as i'm going. i find that works quite well to give a good base. then i do the NSEW thing with my tamp to get it all tucked in pretty well and then tamp hard in the centre. one thing i look for now is the evenness of the tamper to the rim of the basket. when i started doing this i noticed that my tamper when fully depressed always leaned towards the side of the basket closest to me which meant you were depressing the front further down. this is what is likely to be giving you the splatter you were talking about as the coffee is flowing towards you rather than thru the middle. not sure if i explained that too well, if we could post photos i'd be able to explain better.

mattyj

this link might also help you figure out what's going wrong, and maybe how to correct it. http://malachi.coffeed.com/naked-diagnosis.html I hope you start getting good shots out of it!

Reschsmooth

What I have found so far: 1. The 'stockfleth' method, as I understand it from the very good descriptions you guys have provided, comes close to burning my hand! :o 2. With the Pullman tamper (with the ridges), I have a natural tendancy to tamp more on the left side of the pf (I am right handed). 3. Looking up at the basket, the coffee starts to extract at the edges of the basket before moving to overall coverage (argument for a concave/convex tamper?) 4. There is a tendancy for the 'funnel' to be focused on the right hand/front side of the basket - a function of (2) above? I haven't done a comparison between the naked and spouted pf's as yet, but am getting some super sweet shots out of the naked. I may have to invest in some safety goggles to avoid damage from errant fine jets of coffee from channeling! 8) P PS,. I will try to post some photos soon. PPS. Matt - thanks for the link to Malachi's site - it was guite good. PPPS. Is there any point in writing post-scripts on electronic media?

mattyj

re: burning your hand with the stockfleth's move ... just develop those asbestos hands, so you don't feel it burning! I think point 3 suggests that you may have less dense edges than in the middle of the puck. A convex tamp would probably help, but from what I've read, it's more a matter of working on distributing the grinds out to the edges better. It all seems frustrating, not getting perfect pours, but one day, we'll all look back at the frustrations and see that our extractions are much better, and more consistent. It's been like that with latte art for me ... practise and perseverance has helped me to improve a lot!

Reschsmooth

Ok, so I have had the naked pf for about a month now, and, whilst I am getting some good shots, I am not getting the centred 'funnel' the guys on the other site seem to be getting. I might end up with two or three streams most of the way through the shot and they are not converging. I think that perhaps I am overdosing or tamping too hard, because when the shot runs too fast, the centred funnel forms, but it is very fast. One side point - I was pulling some shots a couple of weeks ago, and a jet shot onto my hand. I tasted that (ok, I licked my hand), and the coffee was sour as anything. I must say one thing, the naked pf is pretty cool when serving affagotos! Cheers P

BeanCounter

Patrick, I generally get the funnel forming shortly after the pour starts. With my machine when I flip the lever I get nothing for around 5-6 seconds then the pour starts from 2 or 3 places and that usually converges within 5 seconds. Total pour time for the 1.5-2oz double is 20 seconds. I'm sure I was overdosing on my machine for months. I'm now grinding finer and dosing less and the pulls are much better. Presuming we have the same baskets, I use around 17 grams of coffee and after the tamp there is a couple of mm gap from the ridge down to the start of the coffee. I can load and lock the pf and remove it and there is no disturbance on the top of the puck. If I add another gram or two of coffee, the puck is disturbed by the screen. Regards, Gary

Reschsmooth

And who said you can't learn anything on the internet? Thanks Gary

nzroaster

Your uneven tamp may have something to do with the position of your elbow. Try to get your elbow directly above the tamper so that your forearm is perfectly vertical, and that the tamping movement follows a direct vertical path. With the distribution, try giving the pF a tap when half dosed to level the coffee and fill in any gaps in your untammped puck. Good luck.

Remus

Patrick, I generally get the funnel forming shortly after the pour starts. With my machine when I flip the lever I get nothing for around 5-6 seconds then the pour starts from 2 or 3 places and that usually converges within 5 seconds. Total pour time for the 1.5-2oz double is 20 seconds. I'm sure I was overdosing on my machine for months. I'm now grinding finer and dosing less and the pulls are much better. Presuming we have the same baskets, I use around 17 grams of coffee and after the tamp there is a couple of mm gap from the ridge down to the start of the coffee. I can load and lock the pf and remove it and there is no disturbance on the top of the puck. If I add another gram or two of coffee, the puck is disturbed by the screen. Regards, Gary

that is exactly my experience. finer grind, a touch less coffee and a perfect pour. i went down 2 notches on my grinder to get it right.

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