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Author Topic: Coffee prices in the smaller cities  (Read 3439 times)

Double Ristretto

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Coffee prices in the smaller cities
« on: 19/01/2015, 05:29 PM »
Have seen several articles in the past about how coffee is so much more expensive in Perth than the bigger cities... just went to Adelaide recently and price for an average F.W. seems to be $3.70 - $4.00.

How do they get away with it - more competition in Sydney and Melb?



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Coffee prices in the smaller cities
« Reply #1 on: 19/01/2015, 10:06 PM »
Smaller population and lower turnover combined with greedy landlords makes it a hard slog in SA.

Guess they charge higher prices to try and make a dollar, which in its self is a limiting factor, higher prices = less customers, and so it goes.

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cosmic_couple22

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Coffee prices in the smaller cities
« Reply #2 on: 19/01/2015, 11:54 PM »
Pretty standard pricing from what I have seen from Brisbane to Melbourne with an average closer to $4.00 to $4.50 (FW).
As an espresso or short mac drinker myself (Amandas the flat white girl) pay between $2.50 to $3.50 on the sunny coast.
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Lwowiak

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Coffee prices in the smaller cities
« Reply #3 on: 20/01/2015, 10:58 AM »
Smaller population and lower turnover combined with greedy landlords makes it a hard slog in SA.
That describes Australia in general, but is even more evident in Adelaide.
Unfortunately it is also the downfall of small business.
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Coffee prices in the smaller cities
« Reply #4 on: 20/01/2015, 11:10 AM »
is even more evident in Adelaide.

It certainly is, we spent Christmas NY in NSW, mainly around the Newcastle, Maitland area, coming from SA everything is so prosperous, green and very livable, crossing the NSW/SA border on the return trip was like stepping back in time.

If I was 10 years younger would move East.
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Dry Bean.

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Lwowiak

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Coffee prices in the smaller cities
« Reply #5 on: 20/01/2015, 11:18 AM »
As an espresso or short mac drinker myself ... pay between $2.50 to $3.50 on the sunny coast.

If we assume an espresso is made by splitting a double shot, and the double basket holds 16-18g of coffee, or even up to 20 g of coffee, then the espresso is no more than 10g of coffee.
Say $30-40/kg for the coffee , then the cost is 30 to 40 cents.
I find it hard to justify paying $3.50 for such a beverage, especially as most of the time it is quite average (at the least).
If a double basket of say 20g is used to make a 30 to 40ml espresso ( or even 50ml "double"), then $3 to $3.50 is justifiable, especially if it is a special single origin.

$3.50 for an average house blend espresso is overpriced, especially if a latte or FW is $4 to $4.50.

My opinion only, but hey... its the result of greedy landlords, high wages and a screwed up taxation system that needs to be overhauled.

Instead of forking out $5 for a coffee, my wife and I head to a fresh juice bar. We leave the caffeine for home.

Curiously, the same applies to the corporate world, when catching up with clients during the day, coffee is rejected, but a fresh juice or similar beverage is readily accepted.
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Coffee prices in the smaller cities
« Reply #6 on: 20/01/2015, 11:22 AM »
What really knocks my socks off are the cafe's in Adelaide who charge $3.50 for a shot, same price as a cappa.
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Dry Bean.

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Moon

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Coffee prices in the smaller cities
« Reply #7 on: 20/01/2015, 10:51 PM »
What really knocks my socks off are the cafe's in Adelaide who charge $3.50 for a shot, same price as a cappa.

Which is why you must be larfin .. like the rest of us around here - who can make ourselves rippers at home on our own equipment. Over time .. our initial outlay pays for itself .. so go for it folks ---> we're worth it! :D

cosmic_couple22

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« Reply #8 on: 20/01/2015, 11:04 PM »
$3 to $3.50 Lwowiak for double ris, all the Cafe's I frequent use 22g baskets.  Best coffee is still at home though.
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Coffee prices in the smaller cities
« Reply #9 on: 21/01/2015, 11:41 PM »
The dosage provided by a cafe really is nobody's business and should not be a factor in whether you are receiving adequate or reasonable value for the monies paid.

It's just a perception that is fundamentally  flawed in so many ways.

When you order a cafe coffee you should receive a balanced cup.

Let me tell you that less than 10% of people working in coffee understand what this actually is. Roasters and baristas are in this group.

The majority of specialty cafes in Melbourne bang on about how their beans MUST be no more than 48hrs roasted by the time it is delivered to their establishment.

Don't worry about what the experienced roaster thinks because of course baristas know everything.

So these massive brain baristas then proceed to up dose to 24g in order to extract enough in the cup instead of waiting for the beans to properly develop. Extractions are inconsistent, body is lacking, sweetness is muted and the cup has no balance BUT it is 24g so it must = value.

There is also a tipping point where a large dose results in something that becomes very confusing in the cup.


In contrast if they waited 8 or even 12 days and correctly setup the dose and grind (which could take 500g or up to a kilo to get it prefect - mostly they can't be bothered) they might be able to produce beautifully balanced shots using 18g or less.

Point is - if it's balanced then you will completely enjoy a split shot or a double shot. But only if it has been setup properly.

Grammage do not maketh the cup.





cosmic_couple22

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Coffee prices in the smaller cities
« Reply #10 on: 22/01/2015, 12:35 AM »
How do you combat that Jeff, (influencing customers perception with all the hype that exists) 48 hours is cupping time for me and depending on origin the earliest I consume my own product is 6 days post roast out to sometimes 20 days for those great earthy Yemen's.

Chester
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Lwowiak

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Coffee prices in the smaller cities
« Reply #11 on: 22/01/2015, 01:25 AM »
Jeff, sorry for baiting you, but I was hoping you would join in.
While you are correct that the dosage provided by a CE (coffee establishment) is nobody's business; it is a factor when assessing value for money.
Last time I was in Adelaide I went to a Cibo in the city with clients, and ordered the coffees. I asked for double ristrettos, and also the mandatory latte and FW. I asked for them to be made with a double ristretto. I was charged an additional $1 per beverage for this. My seat afforded me a perfect view of the machine and barista in action. I reordered the same drinks, but omitted the request for the double ristretto base, and also just ordered another ristretto (not a double). I was served identical drinks, and my ristretto was the same volume as the first; even though the first was supposed to be a double.
Your discussion about dosage is spot on. Thank you for the input.
I have been served perfectly balanced and delicious espresso from a split shot, that was 30ml in volume. The CE knew its business.
Far too often I am served a ristretto when ordering an espresso and am lucky to receive  more than a couple of teaspoons worth of beverage. I am sorry, but it is not worth $3.50 to $4, like some CE like to charge.
I won't mention the acidity problem, as that is just common place now. Too many "PURGER" fan boys in the "industry"
Apart from a very select few CE (and I do mean FEW), my wife will not drink espresso when we go out, though she will at home. When in Italy last year, she enjoyed perfectly balanced espressos every day, from many establishments in Rome. In fact at least two a day, especially if she was in the vicinity of one of the Illy specialty bars. No robusta was used in the Illy blend.
While many here in Oz, think that we know everything there is to know about coffee, and that the Italians are far behind us, and only use cheap beans; it makes me wonder how they can consistently serve well balanced and delicious espresso for between 1 to 1.5 euros. And yes they do split a shot.

Personally, I think that if I have to use 20g+ to make a shot of espresso, then there is something seriously wrong with my technique, or my beans (or my roasting).

However..... with some SO, and the odd blend, 21g does produce a very nice gloopy and viscous ristretto with enormous intensity of flavour.

As always there is no right or wrong way, just the pursuit for tasty coffee.
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cosmic_couple22

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Coffee prices in the smaller cities
« Reply #12 on: 22/01/2015, 10:39 AM »
Interesting comments Lwowiak, and something that I experience quite regularly, not sure many people really know what a double ris is in Queensland. As for acidity we have a few local roaster cafes and both polarise their coffee one to high acidity the other to muted darker, roaster influenced flavours. However they have a following so there is no drive to do things differently. Still can't beat a 21g double ris through the slayer at home, thick viscous mouth bombs, perfect.
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