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Coffee Roasting and More => Roasters - Different Roasting Equipment => Topic started by: Muscles on 14/10/2011, 01:53 PM

Title: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Muscles on 14/10/2011, 01:53 PM
Hi All,

With my first child due in 3 weeks I have a good excuse to upgrade my roaster. The Behmor served me well, very well in fact but the small batch size slowly got to me and the chaff all over the kitchen bugged the wife so, what's a guy to do.... Get a KKTO me thinks  ;)



So is the KKTO for me? Anything I should know before I start shopping?
I have been browsing many a KKTO thread online and have had a read of KK's site but I want to know if you were to start this project today with a $1k budget what would you do? My best mate is a sparky so I'll be getting him to perform mods where necessary.

Marc
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Brett H on 14/10/2011, 02:04 PM
I built my own KKTO however if I was to start this project with 1K I would just buy it from Bezzera!!!  I have one 2yo and one on the way but remembering the time (or not) around Millie's birth no project I started at that time had a completion time of under 6 months! 

Do you want coffee now?  Buy it from Bezzera!
Is your wife happy to have you mucking around in the shed revising rebuilding?  Make your own.

I have kept my Behmor but this is now my default roaster!
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Gra on 14/10/2011, 02:27 PM
If you whant to have hands on check out KK's site and buy the parts and build it your self this would be the fastest and easy way of going about it apart from getting one complete.
 
Cheers Gra 
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Koffee Kosmo on 14/10/2011, 03:26 PM
You have 2 options
1) Get a complete kit that is easy to assemble or comes pre assembled at an extra cost 
2) Use select portions of the parts kit to build your own
e.g. Liner, insulation, agitator blade, High temp tubing
You can then create your own

The crucial part of the build is the volume
Any smooth (non rivet handles) 24cm pasta pot will work
However if the pots are not the same measurements as the Arcosteel  or Baccarat Classic then the shaft may need to be altered or build one to suit, as the depth of the insert is mated with the drive shaft length
With DIY you can use a stronger motor to push over 1kg and modify (re Borat) the TO and the roaster will roast 1kg at a time

KK


Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Muscles on 14/10/2011, 03:44 PM
Sorry guys I was always intending to go with the full kit, I should have made that clearer. With the stock motor that comes with the full kit and Borat's relay/switch mod I would be able to do 900gm-1kg batches wouldn't I? I'm sure he said he did 1.2kg comfortably before being limited by the motor?

I guess by mentioning budget I was trying to find out if there are cheap/good/better/best options for me to pursue. ie if anyone had the chance to change a few components or add a mod or two what would you do?

In that budget I would need to cover:
The KKTO Kit $525
Turbo Oven $60
Relay, External Switch and Power Pack $?
USB Data Logger $80?
K-type Probe (or 2?) $??

Additionals:
Bucket/s for cooler $20
Fan to suit $?
Prospecting Seive $?
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Koffee Kosmo on 14/10/2011, 03:59 PM
You can build your own timber base and fit a stronger motor e.g. 12 Volt car window winder motor
I can instruct you on how to build a different base
You should be able to modify the KKTO drive shaft to suit but the rest is the same 

KK
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: borat123 on 14/10/2011, 05:08 PM

Yes, I routinely roast 1kg.   My setup has the 'Frankenturbo' mod, and I still use the standard KKTO motor.  I would also suggest buying the next size up power supply (the cost is about the same), and it does make a difference.

If you want to go for larger batches up past 1kg, then you'll need to think about a bigger motor as suggested.

cheers.
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Brett H on 14/10/2011, 05:13 PM
Paul, you are one great guy!  How many people would offer what you are offering the home roasting community and at no financial gain for yourself!  You've research, tested, built, modified, adapted then made all of your knowledge and results available to all.  More than this you've offered to help people mod your design to suit their existing parts and budget!  Here's to KK!  8)
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Brett H on 14/10/2011, 05:15 PM
I use a windscreen wiper motor however I've never gone past 800g. I may just go out this evening and give the kg a go!
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Bean Flying on 14/10/2011, 05:51 PM
Unbiased opinion I don't own one but at that 2kg figure and limited time it makes sense to go down the path of a KKTO. Better option than a straight Coretto based solution.

My consumption is generally 2-3 roasts a week in the Hottop when I am roasting and I like the variation and time isn't that limited. so 1-1.5kg a fortnight. So this suits me.

Behmor for some is a great point and shoot solution for a lot of people but it's to hard to play with the roast for my liking.

Other option is you can always build up the forarms and do 500g batches by wooden spoon power in a bowl ;D
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Muscles on 14/10/2011, 06:35 PM
Bad choice of title on my behalf as I had already pretty much convinced myself on the KKTO. And the full kit gives me everything I need straight up and pays homage to Paul for all his efforts :)

KKTO Full Kit, Tiffany Turbo Oven, USB Data logger have been ordered. I will try the standard motor first and see how it copes with the 1kg batch size as it is the biggest I'll do for now but it offers piece of mind that I can upgrade it if needed later on. To do 2kg on the Behmor meant around 4hours of roasting/cooling time so this will be a big step up and will no doubt please the wife.

Borat, with your "Frankenturbo", would you do it all the same if you were to do it again? Should I take this opportunity to mod anything else? My mate will help with electrical mods but I don't want to be ringing him with "just one more thing if you can" type requests - I'd rather give him the list up-front.

Anyone else with a KKTO residing here on Crema who has modded their turbo oven?
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: borat123 on 14/10/2011, 07:50 PM

Borat, with your "Frankenturbo", would you do it all the same if you were to do it again? Should I take this opportunity to mod anything else? My mate will help with electrical mods but I don't want to be ringing him with "just one more thing if you can" type requests - I'd rather give him the list up-front.


I find that 1kg is a sweet spot for me in more ways than one.  It's almost a set and forget on my KKTO setup, as the larger roast size with the mod means after the preheat, you just switch the element on and wait until 1C before you need to intervene and do something.

Also a 1kg roast easily fits into 2x 500gm bags and lasts me about a week or a week and a half.  As soon as one bag is gone, I go out and roast another kilo.

If I get lazy, or forget until I'm out of beans, I'll roast 2x 1kg batches.  By the time the first kg is gone, the other bags are already good for drinking...

So coming back to your question, is there anything else on my setup that I'd mod - not really.   Bigger roast batches are only good for me if I happen to be doing more for somebody else.  So I can deal with the limitation of somewhere around a kilo, as it suits my requirements 90% of the time.

You'll need to put in some type of chaff slits.  I actually never tried the pots without slits so I can't say how well it works without them - but it does do a good job with them.

Don't foget to buy a stainless type thermocouple (KK will tell you how to get one), and mount it on the base of the inner pot.  All you need is a small self tapping screw, and a couple of bits of wire to secure the braid on its run up the side of the pot.  If you get a CS meter,  don't bother with the style stick type probe as its a pain in the backside and you don't want to be drilling holes through the side of your pots.

And set yourself up with a combo vac / cooler system so you can just vac the beans straight out of the pot and into the cooler, instead of buggerising around tipping out hot beans.
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Muscles on 16/10/2011, 09:05 AM
KK pointed out which probe to get and the site from which it can be obtained - thanks mate ;)

Slits you say, good excuse to use my Dremel which has been idle for about a year now, anyone care to share pics of their slits  ::)

I'm hoping to knock over the cooler design/build today if I can sneak away to Bunnings...
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Brett H on 16/10/2011, 09:14 AM
Muscles... For goodness sake do not get the Eco-friendly extraction fan. It takes too long to cool. I'm replacing mine! 

I did a 1kg roast yesterday and it worked well.  Its not my most even roast but this will be more about the beans than the roaster.  Lots if imperfections!  The roast was done in 22minutes to 2nd crack but then again my pot is insulated and my TO has the stupid heat shield deflector plate thingy removed.
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Muscles on 16/10/2011, 10:40 AM
Ahhh Brett, I read your post after returning from Bunnings with the Arlec Eco-Friendly  :( I just plugged it in to test how much air movement it could produce and well, let's just say I'll be going back to Bunnings.
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Koffee Kosmo on 16/10/2011, 11:10 AM
Here is a PDF of my cooler design
(see attachment)
KK
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: paranomia on 16/10/2011, 01:10 PM
... the Arlec Eco-Friendly ... air movement ... going back to Bunnings.

Even worse, after a while it forgets which way to blow so I couldn't even use it to make a reliable chaff extractor  :(
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: borat123 on 16/10/2011, 01:23 PM
Here's a pic of my combo vac / extractor fan cooler:

(http://i199.photobucket.com/albums/aa143/ss_0001/cooler.jpg)

(http://i199.photobucket.com/albums/aa143/ss_0001/IMG_1196.jpg)

(http://i199.photobucket.com/albums/aa143/ss_0001/IMG_1199.jpg)

And I don't normally show my slits in public, but hey, here you go.  :o

This is an old pic before I upgraded to the double agitator and the stainless braided probe:

(http://i199.photobucket.com/albums/aa143/ss_0001/IMG_1174.jpg)
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Muscles on 16/10/2011, 03:52 PM
Thanks guys,
I have assembled the cooler and am just waiting to collect a vac from the in-laws tonight as I have been officially banned from using the Dyson.

I went with the Bunnings "Handy Pail", a HPM 360m3/hr exhaust fan (Arlec was 220m3/h)and a 25cm wire mesh sieve from hot dollar.
I cut the cord on the HP and after running it through an airtight bulk-head I wired up an in-line on/off switch.
I also bought a pool cleaning hose. Cutting the fitting off one end allowed me to make an air-tight bulk-head connection through the lid and provides a hose to get the beans out of the KKTO. Will have to see how it holds up to the heat...

When I get home with the Vac tonight I'll decide on the next step. I nearly walked out of Bunnings with a wall mount shop vac that could be fastened to the bucket making it even easier to move to and from the garage ie. less trips up and down stairs.
So far my cooler resembles Borat's one the most. I went with this design as it will allow me to dump from the KKTO and cool in the one bucket.

I'll post some pics a bit later on...
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Brett H on 16/10/2011, 11:56 PM
Excellent work Marc!  Sorry to not have posted sooner but at least you could return yours.  I cut bits off of mine to it it n the bucket so a return for exchange would make an interesting comedy sketch but that's about all.  I looked again at my 1kg roast yesterday and in the clear light of day actually looks far more even that by fluoro in the shed so I am really happy.  Even better it smells wonderful so once again thank you KK for a roaster that will do 1kg beautifully and doesn't cost 5K!
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Muscles on 17/10/2011, 11:42 AM
No worries Brett, I am always up for another run to BUnnings  :D
Father in-law was very sick last night so I didn't bug him about the vac. I think I'll get the wall mount Ozito shop-vac and mount it on my BBQ under the side ledge so I have a roaster/balcony vac always ready for use and this will make it easier to get roasting with less trips to and from the garage and I can do away with the broom.

Here's where I am at with the cooler

Bucket with bulkhead installed for the fans power cable:
(http://i864.photobucket.com/albums/ab207/Muscles2009/Private/Crema/IMG_0218.jpg)

Seive above the fan:
(http://i864.photobucket.com/albums/ab207/Muscles2009/Private/Crema/IMG_0220.jpg)

Lid and pool cleaning hose:
(http://i864.photobucket.com/albums/ab207/Muscles2009/Private/Crema/IMG_0216.jpg)

I'm going to hunt around for a nozzle to put on the end of the pool hose to reduce opening and allow for better suction. Any ideas of something that would hold up with the heat?
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: borat123 on 17/10/2011, 12:13 PM
Don't forget your pipe at the bottom of the bucket too...   ;)

And here's your nozzle:  (it fits exactly into the pool hose flange)

(http://i199.photobucket.com/albums/aa143/ss_0001/vac.jpg)

Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Muscles on 17/10/2011, 12:25 PM
Cheers Borat,
I hadn't forgotten but was waiting until I decided on a Vacuum until chopping the hole.
I hope to be able to NOT chop the steel length on the vacuum though so I can still use it as intended outdoors... might have to hunt for a second spare part. I have to go into Good Guys today to pickup another Smart Grinder for the wifes decaf so I'll look at the vacs there and will finish it off tonight.

Do you find the same port works well enough as an exhaust hole Borat?
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Brett H on 17/10/2011, 12:39 PM
Nice work Marc... be interesting to see what price they offer you on the Smart... I may grab one for plunger duties at school.  The old Lux is getting to be quite noisy. 

Kelsey may be selling his Smart cheaply due to some low-life giving him a bum home roast after a KKTO incident between 1 and 2 crack with a loose agitator and a minute or two's inattentivness  >:(  BUYER BEWARE!!!
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: borat123 on 17/10/2011, 12:44 PM

Do you find the same port works well enough as an exhaust hole Borat?


Yes, it works fine.  I usually start the initial rapid cooling with the vac, then pull it out and switch on the fan to finish it off.

I used some pvc pipe from bunnings, and fitted the inside with rubber to match the diameter of the vac pipe that goes into it.

cheers.
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: askthe coffeeguy on 17/10/2011, 02:55 PM
I can tell you that even before I upgraded my heat source on my KKTO it was still producing amazing coffee

I have no problems roasting up to 1kg at a time - but I'm usually perfectly happy with 800g

The quality of the roasts are second to none, the equipment is hassle free and completely customizable, and the quantities that you can roast on a KKTO are more than enough for home use

But mainly it's the quality and consistency of the roast that appeals to me most - easily on par with cafe quality IMHO

Enough said ...
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Brett H on 17/10/2011, 05:08 PM
I can tell you that even before I upgraded my heat source on my KKTO it was still producing amazing coffee

I have no problems roasting up to 1kg at a time - but I'm usually perfectly happy with 800g

The quality of the roasts are second to none, the equipment is hassle free and completely customizable, and the quantities that you can roast on a KKTO are more than enough for home use

But mainly it's the quality and consistency of the roast that appeals to me most - easily on par with cafe quality IMHO

Enough said ...

I completely agree.  I was skeptical until Paul demoed his unit at a meet and greet and more importantly I got to sample the results.  Now I only use the Behmor for small batches.
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Muscles on 20/10/2011, 10:19 PM
So I have built my KKTO and have a question re the kit. The kit comes with the 2 pieces of silicone tubing. Has anyone found that using the lower one (smaller diameter & joined) that the shaft doesn't seat properly/deep enough? Doing dry runs with green beans I found that if using the lower silicone ring the shaft jumps lifting the perforated pot with it. Without that lower silicone ring I don't have that issue but do find that perforated pot turns with the agitator arm.
So far, with my limited testing and DIY skills I have found that I get a better result using the larger diameter tubing slipped over the lip of the lower, outer pot. This keeps the perforated pot stationary and seats it low enough to engage the shaft properly. Hope that all makes sense...

Hopefully my Turbo Oven will arrive by courier tomorrow so I can start roasting on the weekend. Another question, would the weight of the TO be enough to hold down the perforated drum and shaft and hence stop it "jumping"?

Also finished my bucket cooler :D Got an Ozito shop blower/vac that I have mounted on my BBQ to aid with the cooling and it appears that it will work a treat.
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Koffee Kosmo on 20/10/2011, 10:33 PM
Quote
The kit comes with the 2 pieces of silicone tubing. Has anyone found that using the lower one (smaller diameter & joined) that the shaft doesn't seat properly/deep enough? Doing dry runs with green beans I found that if using the lower silicone ring the shaft jumps lifting the perforated pot with it. Without that lower silicone ring I don't have that issue but do find that perforated pot turns with the agitator arm.

Try pushing the perforated pot down to seat it
The lower tube can be replaced with a fine layer of high temp silicone gel/paste (from the tube) where the two pots join
Its purpose is to seal in the heat or to put it another way not let heat escape

Quote
Hopefully my Turbo Oven will arrive by courier tomorrow so I can start roasting on the weekend. Another question, would the weight of the TO be enough to hold down the perforated drum and shaft and hence stop it "jumping"?

This is very possible
However there are a few easy tweaks to fix anything as all the parts need to marry up & once done its permanent, I am only a PM or call away

KK



Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Muscles on 20/10/2011, 10:51 PM
Thanks Paul, I'll try with the T/O first i guess...
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Muscles on 22/10/2011, 08:27 AM
Okay so I am a few hours away from my maiden voyage with the KKTO.

Any last minute sage advice?
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Koffee Kosmo on 22/10/2011, 09:12 AM
Okay so I am a few hours away from my maiden voyage with the KKTO.

Any last minute sage advice?

Have fun  ;D
And relax - let the roaster do all the work

KK
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: mycuppa on 22/10/2011, 10:41 AM
Best tip = do it when there is nobody around.

It's surprising how easy you can be distracted when someone else is there ....even if they are just watching.

I love talking to people and can talk your head off about all things coffee, but when I'm roasting I even hate it when my staff are nearby as they are bound to ask me questions that can distract me.

Good luck Marc and well done taking a leap onto the successful KKTO platform.
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Muscles on 22/10/2011, 06:18 PM
I completed my first KKTO roast and reckon I did pretty well. I couldn't be bothered trying to figure out why the CS Roast Monitor would not detect an input HID so I proceeded manually. I'll try Roast Logger instead, at least it detected the Victor DMM.

I reckon the roast went well albeit a bit slower than I'd like and I pulled them a bit earlier than I would have with the Behmor, oh and the cooler got them down to 25C in around 3mins so they are a bit lighter than usual for me.

Anyway, here is the result :) 1kg of Nicaragua Matagalpa by way of Green Bean Coffee. Can't wait to try em out!

(http://i864.photobucket.com/albums/ab207/Muscles2009/n_matagalpa.png)
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Brett H on 22/10/2011, 10:48 PM
They look great Marc!  Welcome to the KKTO club!  Look at all those browns.... The best bit for me with these new volumes is that I can finally have a batch last long enough to drink them over a couple of weeks and enjoy their development.  Great job mate... first of many!
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Koffee Kosmo on 22/10/2011, 11:07 PM
You did a good job as a first roast

What do I say in the instructions   ;)
Start with small roasts and get familiar with your roaster and work up to larger roasts

You went to the deep end first up  ;D
Very rarely do I roast 1kg with standard TO
The sweat spot is 500gr to 650gr, - & for 99% of the time I roast 700gr

Welcome to the KKTO club

KK
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Brett H on 23/10/2011, 12:32 AM
How small can these roasters go without the Insert?  I have been too afraid to go under 500g.  I use the Behmor for my 300g roasts but would prefer using the KKTO!
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Koffee Kosmo on 23/10/2011, 12:47 AM
How small can these roasters go without the Insert?  I have been too afraid to go under 500g.  I use the Behmor for my 300g roasts but would prefer using the KKTO!

You can roast 100 grams "but" with care to keep an eye on the heat
On the KKTO due to clearance to the side,  the current agitator blade will mix 300 grams but if one puts a dog clip at the end of the blade it can roast under 300 grams

KK
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Muscles on 23/10/2011, 08:50 AM
Yes KK, I know you said start smaller but I couldn't help myself. If you'd said start with 250g I would probably have started with 500g - just for the challenge. All was not lost anyway, actually far from it but I did see the value in Borat's SSR mod as thermostat turned off the element a few times unnecessarily.

While I have some fine tuning to do I am already VERY glad I made the transition to the KKTO.

I found I kept tripping the power board when I turned on the TO element meaning I had to run a separate extension cord to the power pack for the agitator motor so I'll have to find my heavy duty one in the garage.

For those who have used the solid and the halogen TO's - Do the Halogen elements get up to temp easier than the solid elements? ie is the heat more "instant"?
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Brett H on 23/10/2011, 11:17 AM
You can roast 100 grams "but" with care to keep an eye on the heat
On the KKTO due to clearance to the side,  the current agitator blade will mix 300 grams but if one puts a dog clip at the end of the blade it can roast under 300 grams

KK

Again great advice and great ideas, for free and and with no guarded jealousy or eye-rolling for my noobish inquiry. What a place the world would be if there were more KK's!  Thanks Paul and keep us up to date on your progress Marc!
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Lacehim on 23/10/2011, 10:49 PM
You can roast 100 grams "but" with care to keep an eye on the heat
On the KKTO due to clearance to the side,  the current agitator blade will mix 300 grams but if one puts a dog clip at the end of the blade it can roast under 300 grams

KK

I also found a few got stuck in the middle.  I used a BIG bull dog clip for the middle, and a little one at the end on one side.  Worked a treat, and I roasted a few batches of 100gm for my syphon.  I also used the extension ring (not sure what KK calls it) at the top to add more volume and extend the roast time.

For those who have used the solid and the halogen TO's - Do the Halogen elements get up to temp easier than the solid elements? ie is the heat more "instant"?

I have both.  I found roast times where very similar, but the light is a bonus.  I can now roast at night too! :)
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: coffeehorse on 23/10/2011, 10:57 PM
Comparing Tiffany (older, S/H) to Kmart Homemaker (halogen, new)

Tiffany didn't switch on/off problematically
Homemaker with guard on switched too much
Homemaker got up to temp quicker and had a smaller dead band.
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Koffee Kosmo on 23/10/2011, 11:12 PM
I also found a few got stuck in the middle.  I used a BIG bull dog clip for the middle, and a little one at the end on one side.  Worked a treat, and I roasted a few batches of 100gm for my syphon.  I also used the extension ring (not sure what KK calls it) at the top to add more volume and extend the roast time.


I think I may have helped you with that same question Lacehim a few months ago
The beta testers got an adapter ring 
However, to keep costs down & to make a fully working roaster more affordable the Stainless Steel TO Adapter Ring  is an added extra
But its not needed for small batch roasting if you keep a close eye on the heat

(http://koffeekosmo.com.au/components/com_virtuemart/shop_image/product/Stainless_Steel__4c2d66c1cd7d4.jpg)

KK
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: GaryatGala on 27/10/2011, 03:06 AM
At my current savings rate, i should be an adopter for the KKTO come Christmas.
                 Koffee Kosmo has been very kind as to send me a sample of his roasted Peru to try. 
I ran a blind test of Paul's batch versus my coretto roasted batch, which was Peru as well.

Two lots of double shots were made on my Miss Silvia, and on each double, one was an espresso, and the other made into a flat white.

Without knowing which one came from, a friend helped to label them A and B on the first round. I tasted them, noted them mentally down and he then proceeded to make the second round, just for consistency in this cupping and then tasted again.

Both times label A as an espresso was better than B. Was sweeter, more flavoursome with pleasant acidity, had more body and poured nicely into the cup, more smoother and did not blond as early as label B. As flat white, both are similar, though label B was a bit more punchier, more bite, so to speak, but not much in it according to my taste buds.

I declared label A the winner, and it was revealed that it was KK's beans. Overall i'm impressed, and will have no qualms adding the KKTO soon to my stable of popper, coretto, and the FZ-RR700 Baby Roaster.

Upgraditis, here we go again  ;) Looking forward to joining the KKTO mob.

Gary at G
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: GaryatGala on 27/10/2011, 02:57 PM
I forgot to mention another reason to get it was to roast for others.

I'm the only coffee drinker in the house, so the Baby Roaster does fine in that regards, but since i've got people wanting beans from me on a regular basis, now i want to give them something better in the cup than the coretto.

No matter what i do, shorter roast times, longer roast times, DMM logging all the way, uncovered, covered, insulated etc i find the taste quite acidic. As an espresso, it is brighter and acidic compared to the Baby Roaster.
As a milk coffee, this acidity does put it in it's favour a bit, especially if sugar is added.

I just want something that's affordable, can roast a 500 - 700gm batches and is a drum roasting principle.
That's where the KKTO fits the bill for me.

This waiting is going to kill me a bit, but i'll have to be patient til christmas, so in the meantime, i'll be saving up all the tips from the restaurant customers.

Then after the KKTO, maybe i'll go for the Breville  ;)

Gary at G
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Brett H on 27/10/2011, 05:10 PM
I forgot to mention another reason to get it was to roast for others.

I'm the only coffee drinker in the house, so the Baby Roaster does fine in that regards, but since i've got people wanting beans from me on a regular basis, now i want to give them something better in the cup than the coretto.

No matter what i do, shorter roast times, longer roast times, DMM logging all the way, uncovered, covered, insulated etc i find the taste quite acidic. As an espresso, it is brighter and acidic compared to the Baby Roaster.
As a milk coffee, this acidity does put it in it's favour a bit, especially if sugar is added.

I just want something that's affordable, can roast a 500 - 700gm batches and is a drum roasting principle.
That's where the KKTO fits the bill for me.

This waiting is going to kill me a bit, but i'll have to be patient til christmas, so in the meantime, i'll be saving up all the tips from the restaurant customers.

Then after the KKTO, maybe i'll go for the Breville  ;)

Gary at G

The batch size of the KK and the taste were the big draw cards for me... that and I had all of the bits around the house.  You won't know yourself Gary come Christmas. But surely Perth is like Townsville... Don't ya just leave he beans in the sun to roast?  :rofl:
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: GaryatGala on 28/10/2011, 11:59 PM
Hi there Brett.  Hee hee,

The north west part of this state can certainly guarantee divots and scorching of the beans together with cooking bacon n eggs on the rocks there.

Down here in Perth though, the weather has been acting strange. Broke the October record for wettest month and very mild temps.

Blaming it on the Queen who's bought in the British weather to CHOGM.

Getting towwy now. The coffee journey is a source of sweet pain.
I'm not one to steal, beg or borrow. Prefer to save up the old fashioned way.

The joy of looking forward to a new toy. . .   :tearhair:

Gary at G
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Brett H on 29/10/2011, 12:41 AM
I can guarantee it'll be worth the wait... Like chogm... Although you probably can't wait for that to be over!
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Muscles on 29/10/2011, 07:53 PM
Yesterday I roasted 500g of the Geisha from Bean Green, 1st crack at 11:30 and pulled at 15:30 before 2nd crack. I couldn't resist trying it today and am impressed already. Will try it again in a few days.
I also roasted some of the Colombian SW Decaf  for the wife today, another 500g batch in the KKTO and it looks awesome. 1st crack at 11:05 and I dumped when 2nd came at 15:50.  Think I'll be trying my first ever decaf...
Oh, both of the two above batches were with a halogen TO. I know I wasn't doing the 1kg like my first roast but it did seem easier to get up to temp and to control the heat between 1st and 2nd cracks with the halogen.
I love my KKTO!  ;D
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: coffeehorse on 30/10/2011, 03:42 PM
Should the mods just delete all the replies on this topic, make it a sticky, and edit the original post content to 'Yes.'?
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: GaryatGala on 30/10/2011, 04:51 PM
Should the mods just delete all the replies on this topic, make it a sticky, and edit the original post content to 'Yes.'?

In my defense, i have not yet acquired the KKTO, so i was making enquiries about this roaster.
I have 3 other roasters in my stable, so i did ask myself the question, "Do I Need A KKTO?"

With the help of these wonderful people on this forum, they helped me to decide, and that is Yes! I do need a KKTO.
Not just because of another roaster in the ever growing stable, but for the search of a better cup.

Why delete these replies?

We spent a good part of our time putting words and thoughts together to support and help each other in this community.

Gary at G
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Koffee Kosmo on 30/10/2011, 05:49 PM
Excellent news fellow roasters
I am very pleased that everyone is getting good results from the KKTO design

It has been a great success with many happy users around the world 
I still answer several emails per day helping someone out with a DIY problem

Most of you may know that I have 20+ design variations to the theme
I have been entertaining the idea of a new model that is not a kit
Recently I have combined all the best aspects of the many design variations and put them down to paper

Next step is to get a cost to produce and if all the stars align I may proceed 
I need to seek advice on -- at what price point it will break the camels back

KK



Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Brett H on 30/10/2011, 11:05 PM
Excellent news fellow roasters
I am very pleased that everyone is getting good results from the KKTO design

It has been a great success with many happy users around the world 
I still answer several emails per day helping someone out with a DIY problem

Most of you may know that I have 20+ design variations to the theme
I have been entertaining the idea of a new model that is not a kit
Recently I have combined all the best aspects of the many design variations and put them down to paper

Next step is to get a cost to produce and if all the stars align I may proceed 
I need to seek advice on -- at what price point it will break the camels back

KK

Wow.  Very exciting times indeed!  What batch size would the new model run to? 
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Koffee Kosmo on 30/10/2011, 11:30 PM
Wow.  Very exciting times indeed!  What batch size would the new model run to?

Same as now
But with greater heat stability & retention control
Isn't 700 grams enough with the possibility of 1 Kg  ;)

To roast a greater weight
I need to have the TO specially made for me & that will involve a minimum order of 1000 units
Plus extra costs to have it made with a plug and play profile control

Anybody with large deep pockets or an electronic guru care to help out  ;D

KK
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Brett H on 31/10/2011, 05:03 PM
Same as now
But with greater heat stability & retention control
Isn't 700 grams enough with the possibility of 1 Kg  ;)

To roast a greater weight
I need to have the TO specially made for me & that will involve a minimum order of 1000 units
Plus extra costs to have it made with a plug and play profile control

Anybody with large deep pockets or an electronic guru care to help out  ;D

KK


I'm thinking a theme and variation: a cement truck with a jet engine aimed at it. Roast capacity of 1.5 tons and ultimate bragging rights... What could possibly go wrong?
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Kelsey on 31/10/2011, 05:26 PM
Well you'd need to get the agitation blades right.  ;)
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Lacehim on 31/10/2011, 07:14 PM
Borat where did you get the braided probe from?  That might have been my issue...

I might revisit the whole DMM thing again.
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: WotB on 31/10/2011, 10:45 PM
Unless it was arranged.  Then you're not allowed to see, smell or hear until it's too late.
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Brett H on 01/11/2011, 07:56 AM
Unless it was arranged.  Then you're not allowed to see, smell or hear until it's too late.

 :rofl: Gold!
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Muscles on 09/01/2012, 09:17 PM
A question for all you KKTO owners and I am sure it's probably been asked before: how do you clean the TO lid? Will mild soapy water cut it or should I use some of the E61 cleaning powder that Matt ever so kindly gave me with my cup order?
I want to write a review on it and need to take some pics but I want the KKTO looking it's best and it'd be handy to see what's going on inside again :)
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Koffee Kosmo on 09/01/2012, 09:40 PM
A question for all you KKTO owners and I am sure it's probably been asked before: how do you clean the TO lid? Will mild soapy water cut it or should I use some of the E61 cleaning powder that Matt ever so kindly gave me with my cup order?
I want to write a review on it and need to take some pics but I want the KKTO looking it's best and it'd be handy to see what's going on inside again :)

Use rinsing water with care
I use back-flush powder and a partially wet not scratch scourer sponge

Take care not to squeeze water in the TO electronics
Rub gently on the glass keeping the TO at a downward angle as a precaution
Wipe off access with a wet cloth several times and rinsing off soap/chemical from cloth as needed until gleaming

If you have a steady hand you can rinse under a slow running tap again keeping the TO at a downward angle then finish off with a cloth

KK


Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Muscles on 09/01/2012, 09:43 PM
Thanks KK, I'll just roll up the sleeves and give it a go. I'll try the espresso machine cleaner from E61, some hot water and lots of elbow grease. I won't be using it for another 5 days so it will have plenty of time to dry out.
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Koffee Kosmo on 09/01/2012, 09:50 PM
Thanks KK, I'll just roll up the sleeves and give it a go. I'll try the espresso machine cleaner from E61, some hot water and lots of elbow grease. I won't be using it for another 5 days so it will have plenty of time to dry out.

It actually comes off & cleans very easily and it only takes about 10 minutes  :thumb:

KK
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Muscles on 09/01/2012, 10:33 PM
Hmm, maybe you clean yours more regularly or you use a stronger solution with the cafetto because I just spent 15 minutes in a 2 inch squared section of the glass and could still see brown staining. Never fear though - a small dab of selleys blue-gel oven cleaner and it was as easy as wipe on, wipe off. Next, a quick rinse with espresso cleaner solution that was still in the sink and dry with paper towel. I'll make sure I do a 1/2 hour emprty roast to cook off any remnants before roasting in it next weekend.  :thumb:
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Muscles on 27/03/2012, 01:57 PM
Question re small batches.
I tried doing a test run without heat of 100gm PNG Robusta and found that the agitator blade just pushed the beans around without them even turning over ie, they stayed in same position but slid along the bottom. What mods are out there for the agotator blade to make it get under the beans and turn them over? Anyone else found a solution for agitating small batches?
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Brett H on 27/03/2012, 05:06 PM
Question re small batches.
I tried doing a test run without heat of 100gm PNG Robusta and found that the agitator blade just pushed the beans around without them even turning over ie, they stayed in same position but slid along the bottom. What mods are out there for the agotator blade to make it get under the beans and turn them over? Anyone else found a solution for agitating small batches?

Have you tried a bulldog clip?
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Muscles on 27/03/2012, 09:11 PM
No I haven't, yet. I reckon I'd need at least a few of them on each blade of the agitator to get the needed coverage and can't really see how they would get under the beans to aid in turning them over. I'll buy a box tomorrow and try on the weekend I guess but I don't think it will work for what I am experiencing, but you never know 'til you try right ;)
Title: Re: Do I need a KKTO?
Post by: Koffee Kosmo on 27/03/2012, 11:33 PM
I know that Lacehim posted a photo and results of to dog clip mod but can't find it

KK