Hot chocolate - What do you think makes the best hot chocolate?

blackbird · July 2011

Hi Guys,

Id like to introduce our selves, we are couple from the central coast nsw, married 2 kids etc.

Interests are coffee culture, food, technology, arts ete etc.

Unfortunately we cant drink coffee, due to the bitter taste and my husbands allergic to it, we both love the smell of it though, its so good.

Id like to ask a question, what makes a great hot chocolate and what type of profile are your customers looking for?

E.g do they want it Milky, creamy, fruity, woody, strong cocoa notes, slightly bitter like coffee, or sweet etc

Is it important for it be natural with natural ingredients or does it matter if it has additives if the flavour is better.

Would you prefer to use real chocolate or a powder due to cost and connivence.

We have been talking about this at our local cafe and was wondering what everyone else thought.

RichardM · July 2011

I personally think most people just like something sweet when they order a hot chocolate. For me, if I have hot chocolate, I want to just start with a good quality cocoa (I personally use the Double Dutch Pure Cocoa), and add sugar for my guests in a 1/3 cocoa, 2/3 sugar mix. Simple and tastes VERY similar to if you melt real chocolate into the milk. I sometimes have guests who still add sugar to this though.....(no doubt to get it similar to the supermarket style ones that are closer to 80% sugar). Just for reference, cocoa is far more bitter than coffee shots - it's only because it's accepted that it is had with so much sugar that it isn't bitter.

shape_shifter · July 2011

'bitter' what bitter taste, none of my coffee tastes bitter ;D I think you might have been drinking crap coffee, roasted until black and oily and had scalding hot water all over it

No seriously I would like to explore the 'bitter' thing has others have said it before to me and they have been hell bent on not talking to me about it as they are so set in their ideas that they won't consider that coffee can be anything else but bitter.

blackbird · July 2011

Love the bitter comment :D, I have tasted some great coffee that wasnt bitter, but it is an acquired taste, my husband gets headaches and stomach aches. The sensitivity to bitterness and acid in the coffee also depends on the number of taste buds you have. I agree on the cocoa, and chocolate comment, I think people are coming around though. It seems alot of cafes use powder?

shape_shifter · July 2011

...back to the cocoa though... I have the Double Dutch as well but I really do love the Cote d'Ivoire Red African Cocoa, it has a spice type flavour to it that just puts it in a world of it's own. My OH loves it too. I do 50/50 cocoa/sugar at the most, majority of the time it's less sugar. Again though I don't find either of the cocoas bitter and I can tell you I've pulled some really bitter shots when I first started in my coffee journey ;D Just to add, yes both of the above are powders which I make up with a small bit of water as it's heating to mix it all through into a thick liquid.

WotB · July 2011

There's no reason why you can't use a good couverture for hot chocolate. It may be a bit cost prohibitive, but the results will be fantastic.

shape_shifter · July 2011

WotB, a bit like Max Brennar? I've never been there, sorry, never tasted it, I walked into one today but walked out with nothing as I wasn't sure. I know they do a cup one where you melt the chocolate over heat and suck it through a metal straw.

adelaidecoffee · July 2011

We also use the double dutch, so quantites are dependant on cup size but what Richard Says above is about the ratio - 1 tsp DD cocoa, 1 tbspn sugar and some rich, fatty milk and a piece or 2 of decent dark chocolate to dip and bobs your uncle.

blackbird · July 2011

Great to hear people are using good quality cocoa and making it themselves, some of the cocoas are quite expensive though. Agree cocoa can be very bitter, depends on region, ive tasted some organic cocoa that tastes like dirt, not very nice, but very expensive. My opinion is people dont know what good chocolate tastes like, probably alot like coffee until they have had it, everybody eats cadbury dairy mik so thats what they are used too.

adelaidecoffee · July 2011

author=blackbird link=topic=1756.msg14769#msg14769 date=1309956472 My opinion is people dont know what good chocolate tastes like, probably alot like coffee until they have had it, everybody eats cadbury dairy mik so thats what they are used too.

We usually always have some decent dark choc in the house. Currently we have some of Willy's cocao in the cupboard. You may of seen his show on sbs or abc about his chocolate. Cadbury's and stuff like that you may as well eat a bag of sugar instead.

Koffee_Kosmo · July 2011

In the KK household we have a problem I drink and eat chocolate My wife will only drink and eat "White Chocolate" My preferred mix is a 50/50 chock/sugar mix but I use the sticky brown sugar KK

blackbird · July 2011

Yum, chocolate and chilli just like the Aztecs, I love that, I saw the Willys program on sbs, very cool, hes got alot of passion.

beanflying · July 2011

Will there be samples for the unpaid market research ;D For customers I have been running 100% Cocoa powders. Rounded teaspoon dissolved in a little hot water add milk and steam. We run the 2 Cocoas from offered on CS at about 90% dutch processed to 10% of the African style (spicy and earthy). I have tried a few of the better pre sugared cocoas and been really unimpressed with the flavour for a start. Interestingly enough less Hot Choc customers add sugar than Coffee customers out of habit even with the unsweetened cocoa. At home love a slight grind of chilli over the African on a winters night.

WotB · July 2011

on 1309955422:

WotB, a bit like Max Brennar? I've never been there, sorry, never tasted it, I walked into one today but walked out with nothing as I wasn't sure. I know they do a cup one where you melt the chocolate over heat and suck it through a metal straw.

It certainly won't be your typical hot chocolate, more of a European style, less milk, more choc. You can have a muck around with some 63% couverture from Plaistowe. It won't break the bank compared to others and it's pretty easily accessible from major supermarkets. I've had some wild flavours coming out of a Weiss couverture, single origin Brazil. Not everyone's liking, but enjoyable for what it is.

Muscles · July 2011

I've been mucking around with the chocolate syrup from Alchemy Cordials and adding some extra couveture choc and/or 70% cocoa in varying ratios. Haven't settled on a "recipe" yet so this thread interests me.

on 1309956706:

Currently we have some of Willy's cocao in the cupboard. You may of seen his show on sbs or abc about his chocolate.

I liked the series and have been tempted to get some myself... Did you buy it locally or from Willy's site?

adelaidecoffee · July 2011

on 1310011692:

I liked the series and have been tempted to get some myself... Did you buy it locally or from Willy's site?

There is a stockist here in Adelaide.... hot2trot on o'connel rd if anyone here in SA interested. This is where i got mine from.

askthecoffeeguy · July 2011

At my work we use a blend of 45% cocao and the balance sugar - and add hot water to make a syrup, then blend this with milk in the glass For best results we add around 40mls of thick syrup to the bottom of a latte glass and then top to 3/4 full with steamed milk - then steam the contents of the glass to blend ingredients, and fill to the top with textured milk to provide a creamy, layered effect - delicious!

Dry_bean. · July 2011

on 1310013400:

There is a stockist here in Adelaide.... hot2trot on o'connel rd if anyone here in SA interested. This is where i got mine from.

Morning AC, guess you mean O'Connell Street North Adelaide.

adelaidecoffee · July 2011

on 1310087008:

At my work we use a blend of 45% cocao and the balance sugar - and add hot water to make a syrup, then blend this with milk in the glass For best results we add around 40mls of thick syrup to the bottom of a latte glass and then top to 3/4 full with steamed milk - then steam the contents of the glass to blend ingredients, and fill to the top with textured milk to provide a creamy, layered effect - delicious!

Yours sounds really good if you were in SA i'd come and visit. Sounds as though you have experimented a bit to get the best hot choc you can.

on 1310087599:

Morning AC, guess you mean O'Connell Street North Adelaide.

Thats the one, maybe around no.85.

blackbird · July 2011

Lots of people using their own cocoa mix and not chocolate, nice to see, I thought most cafes used preblended mixed ones, has anyone tried any good hot chocolate mixes?

Koffee_Kosmo · July 2011

on 1310122962:

Lots of people using their own cocoa mix and not chocolate, nice to see, I thought most cafes used preblended mixed ones, has anyone tried any good hot chocolate mixes?

If you haven't already noticed Most members are a little pedantic with the consumption of Coffee, Tea, Chocolate We like to do things in the most flavoursome, wholesome & traditional way My method is 100% cocoa powder in a 50% / 50% mix with sticky brown sugar Add hot water over the cocoa powder, stir to melt & liquefy it Add the sugar and add a little more hot water if required again stir to melt & liquefy Steam milk on the coffee machine and add it progressive to the waiting chocolate while stirring Finish off with a little foam on top Sometimes I melt down 85% chocolate and follow the above again KK

blackbird · July 2011

Yeah noticed that, I like good quality chocolate for hot chocolates or a nice mix with some dutch processed cocoa personally.

beanflying · July 2011

on 1310122962:

Lots of people using their own cocoa mix and not chocolate, nice to see, I thought most cafes used preblended mixed ones, has anyone tried any good hot chocolate mixes?

Your 'average' cafe will do whatever is easiest. Without wanting to stereotype a group either the Mum's with kids in tow want their drink hot, sweet, with flavour being a distant third in most cases preblended brand X will do the job :P . If you used a sugar/cocoa/choc blend or not some people will still throw in 2 more sugars without tasting first regardless. I am a little interested to try some of the prepak single serve options and see if they are better than what I currently do. I can get some couverture choc too so as winter is here time for some more playing.

adelaidecoffee · July 2011

on 1310263578:

Your 'average' cafe will do whatever is easiest. Without wanting to stereotype a group either the Mum's with kids in tow want their drink hot, sweet, with flavour being a distant third in most cases preblended brand X will do the job :P . If you used a sugar/cocoa/choc blend or not some people will still throw in 2 more sugars without tasting first regardless.

Most/many have no desire or intention of changing or doing anything that will see improvement. Some stick with the market they cater for and see no reason to change, unless of course they can get a cheaper product. Some dont know what the heck they are doing. Quality of ingredients, experimentation and good execution seperates the best from the rest. Enough ramble ::) .... wheres the coffee?

askthecoffeeguy · July 2011

I also have a SO Ecuadorian 65% coco blend at my work but really speaking its too dark and 'bitter' for most punters - although there are definitely some aficionados out there myself included who like it!

CodyDeegan · July 2011

im not much into sweet but for hot chocolate i like the bitter sweet taste..

Gra · July 2011

I am not hot chocolate drinker but the wife likes a cup so I picked up a 1kg of this and she likes it not to sweet. Zokoko is the new brand of fine chocolate products made by Dean Morgan - a highly experienced and talented coffee roaster. Zokoko Drinking Chocolate uses a non-alkalised organic cocoa powder and organic sugar blend. A sweet and satisfying chocolate indulgence. Contains 30% cocoa solids. Gluten Free. Dairy Free. The organic drinking chocolate is made from scratch from cocoa beans bought from ethically-sound, organically certified farms in the Domincan Republic. The cocoa is guaranteed to use no child labour in it's production. The result is a very fine drinking chocolate - not as sweet or strong as some commercial brands, but tuned to more adult tastes. Gra..

Brett H · July 2011

on 1310445740:

I am not hot chocolate drinker but the wife likes a cup so I picked up a 1kg of this and she likes it not to sweet. Zokoko is the new brand of fine chocolate products made by Dean Morgan - a highly experienced and talented coffee roaster. Zokoko Drinking Chocolate uses a non-alkalised organic cocoa powder and organic sugar blend. A sweet and satisfying chocolate indulgence. Contains 30% cocoa solids. Gluten Free. Dairy Free. The organic drinking chocolate is made from scratch from cocoa beans bought from ethically-sound, organically certified farms in the Domincan Republic. The cocoa is guaranteed to use no child labour in it's production. The result is a very fine drinking chocolate - not as sweet or strong as some commercial brands, but tuned to more adult tastes. Gra..

We've had this as well as the two BB offerings. My favorite however is Arkadia Chocolata Doro which steams into a wonderful thick rich drink. I've found that by steaming it into the milk it doesn't form a skin unlike stove-top methods.

Koffee_Kosmo · July 2011

OK with all this talk of hot chocolate and the weather just perfect for it I decide to make one or two You see the daughter likes a good hot chocolate I asked what would she like in terms of sweetness & mouth feel She said dad you make it sweet enough but can I have it feel like mouse plese Hmmmm I said I mixed the cocoa & sugar as I noted above and placed it aside in the cup to be used I then steamed milk to stiff foam at about 1/3 past cappuccino I poured the thin part of the milk in the cocoa mixture and gave it a stir Then followed it with the thick foam I folded the foam in with a spoon to keep the mixture thick and presented it for appraisal All I got was mmmm, mmmm, mmmm Made one for myself So call it a success of a light & fluffy mouse style hot chocolate KK

Dry_bean. · July 2011

This is what the SMH suggests in the Sydney area. :-\ http://www.smh.com.au/entertainment/restaurants-and-bars/three-of-a-kind--hot-chocolate-20110709-1h7ed.html

beanflying · July 2011

on 1310512119:

This is what the SMH suggests in the Sydney area. :-\

Interesting read. But at $5.80 for a hot chocolate and people whinge about $3.50 for a coffee ::) Still some interesting twists on the hot choc theme.

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