On the prowl for a new grinder.....

Cuir Beluga · June 2015

Hi all, as it says, I am on the look out for a new grinder. My birthday is coming up and my family are usually quite generous with cash presents so I figured I may as well start thinking ahead :P.

I have narrowed it down to the Compak Touch, Macap M2D or the Macap M2M.

So what say you all? The good, the bad and the ugly.

Also feel free to suggest anything else in the same price bracket. I could be tempted to spend a bit more if something is well and truly worth it.

3,2,1.....Go

Brett H · June 2015

I would also look at the Eureka Mignon. The M2M looks great!!

GeekKopi · June 2015

Hi Sue. I posted a quick review on the m2m in the grinder section. Basically it's a neat little package with minimal electronics and with fine stepped adjustments. I 'upgraded' to this grinder from the mazzer mini manual. I also looked at the compak gbut their look didn't appeal to me. The compak is stepless and the m2m isn't but the steps are small and you can always compensate with the tamp.

Cuir Beluga · June 2015

I have been looking at the Mignon too Brett and can honestly say it stands a good chance of coming home with me :P. I will re-read your review GeekKopi. Can I ask why the Compak didn't appeal? That is the one I am leaning towards- stepless and burrs vs stepped and blades.

GeekKopi · June 2015

on 1434237111:

I will re-read your review GeekKopi. Can I ask why the Compak didn't appeal? That is the one I am leaning towards- stepless and burrs vs stepped and blades.

It was simply a matter of styling. The Macap just looked better (to me). Performance wise in the cup? Same difference.

Cuir Beluga · June 2015

Great, thanks Geek

.

GeekKopi · June 2015

on 1434237871:

Great, thanks Geek .

here are some pics of it. Don't mind the pink decorations you see in the background. It's baby shower day.

Cuir Beluga · June 2015

Oooohh, so nice and shiny. Lovely pics thanks Geek. It looks kind of tall

. What if a boy pops out :o?

GeekKopi · June 2015

on 1434239806:

Oooohh, so nice and shiny. Lovely pics thanks Geek. It looks kind of tall . What if a boy pops out :o?

Not tall at all Sue. It's just the camera angle. It's a bit shorter than my espresso machine. Boy? Then we're screwed. It's all good. DNA tests and ultrasounds show it's a girl.

Cuir Beluga · June 2015

Goodo, thanks Geek

. I wanted 3d scanning done but then figured we would see a little too much so didn't do it :P.

GeekKopi · June 2015

on 1434240695:

Goodo, thanks Geek . I wanted 3d scanning done but then figured we would see a little too much so didn't do it :P.

Same here. My wife thought about 3d scanning but then it would give away too much. We already found out the baby's sex so the only surprise left is how she looks.

Brett H · June 2015

I'm not a fan of all of the lower-numbered Compkas. To much collar movement in the K3 I owned and others I've used. By the time you start geting into great ba g for buck territory you're at a pretty pointy end and they don't look aesthetically pleasing there either. Having said that every grinder has its idiosyncrasies and will demand an interim learning-curve.

Cuir Beluga · June 2015

I waited until they were born to find out what they were. Matt I had a gut feeling he was a boy but Ben I was all over the place, first I thought he was a girl and then around 6 months I thought probably a boy because his movements were brutal. I used to squeal at times ;D.

Cuir Beluga · June 2015

on 1434241380:

I'm not a fan of all of the lower-numbered Compkas. To much collar movement in the K3 I owned and others I've used. By the time you start geting into great ba g for buck territory you're at a pretty pointy end and they don't look aesthetically pleasing there either. Having said that every grinder has its idiosyncrasies and will demand an interim learning-curve.

Thanks Brett for that, you may just have saved me a few $$. Funny, I too think the pricier they get the less easier on the eye they get. Not all of course but some I have looked at.

GeekKopi · June 2015

I too share that view point except for when it comes to the Elektra Nino (large conical). I think it's the bees knees.

Cuir Beluga · June 2015

That is nice Geek, very nice

. Anyway if anyone else wants to chime in or make a suggestion please do. I'm off out for the day with my boys. Have a great day all

.

Brett H · June 2015

on 1434242193:

I too share that view point except for when it comes to the Elektra Nino (large conical). I think it's the bees knees.

I'd forgotten about that one.... How's it for grinds retention? Also, for that price I want a tamper that doesn't look like a dinky afterthought. The Versalab was my dream for a long time before someone who was a coffee shop owner and straight-talker de-bunked that myth for me

GeekKopi · June 2015

on 1434245544:

I'd forgotten about that one.... How's it for grinds retention? Also, for that price I want a tamper that doesn't look like a dinky afterthought. The Versalab was my dream for a long time before someone who was a coffee shop owner and straight-talker de-bunked that myth for me

no idea on grind retention on this one Brett. But if spending $3k for this one for home use I'm sure the owner can afford to grind through 100grams of beans before hand to purge old beans.

In a cafe setting this would look awesome and perform on par with the Robur from what I have read. Never seen it in real life though.

Koffee_Kosmo · June 2015

Not only myself but countless others have been on this path as well With my first espresso machine I went to top end at first and was glad I did However with the grinder I started with an entry level unit while my mid level grinder became available Well that was a few grinders ago Now that I have a large conical I really can't go back A good coffee grinder makes more sense and is more important than one thinks So I recommend that you skip all future upgrades and save up for a large conical KK

Brett H · June 2015

Problem is mate that Sue doesn't have bench-space to burn. I own three large commercials but I'm not normal! These nice people are normal and we've not scared them off yet. Steady KK, steady mate

Koffee_Kosmo · June 2015

Maybe it's best to trial some grinders from members that live nearby and decide KK

Cuir Beluga · June 2015

Lol at you not normal lot :laugh:. Space is tight here unfortunately as Brett mentioned. Great idea KK but I don't think there is anyone close by :thumb:.

FreshCoffee2 · June 2015

Just be aware that different individuals have different needs, wants and expectation, and some have genuinely "better" palates while others dont....allowing some to genuinely discern different characteristics in the espresso, while others genuinely cant OR simply dont care because they are not looking for that...and may only be looking for a great milk coffee. Horses for courses, and what works for one individual doesnt necessarily work for someone else. I therefore submit (as I have done time and again), that it is really necessary to define the meaning of the word "better", in the context of what an individual wants from his or her grinder, and that you have to be very very careful when interpreting the info that is written up on the internerd in respect of this ("better grinders"). May I add some random pointers that I have found to be useful in the context of the original question of this topic, and some of the replies that have come up: a) Eureka Mignon an excellent baby commercial espresso grinder, but has now been priced out of its market section through manufacturer price increases. b) I have personally conducted a comparative test of brew quality (espresso) between the Mignon (50mm) and a much larger (75mm) excellent name commercial grinder using the same bag of beans and espresso machine and operator (me) to see if I could discern any significant difference between the quality of the brews due to size of grinding burrs....and I could not find any, for single coffees, where the grinders have not been overheated through continuous use (as would happen in cafe use and where the larger grinder would be "better" than the smaller one....but this is not the case here where these grinders are intended for home use). This is very important in respect of all the stuff written on the internerd about "bigger being better"...because I couldnt find any significant difference between the good name 50mm grinder and the 75 mm grinder (both planar - flat - grinding plates). c) Macap M2M an excellent baby commercial espresso grinder, has overtaken the Eureka Mignon simply due to significantly better price for equivalent performance. d) the Compak K3 is a 58mm grinder as opposed to the Mignon and M2M at 50mm. Does the extra size of the plates mean anything? Please read below. I like the small stepped adjuster of the M2M much much better. e) Generally speaking, the diff between (good) grinders using planar or flat grinding plates, and those using conical grinding burrs, is that for the same bag of beans, the flat plate grinders will (if you have the palate to be able to discern this in an espresso) give you an espresso with more body ("bottom end") , while the conical grinder will give you a coffee with more "clarity" (less bottom end, more medium to top end). If you dont drink blacks, do you "need" a commercial sized conical grinder with corresponding price tag? f) contrary to popular urban belief, conical grinders are not "better" than grinders with planar or flat grinding plates from the point of view of grind quality. The character in an espresso may be slightly different to someone that is looking for that, but conicals are designed and built and are primarily "better" for the reason that the conical grinding burrs last significantly LONGER in commercial volume use before they wear out and start to wreck the grinds if the burrs are not changed out.... the fact that the resulting brew, when compared to that from a flat plated grinder using the same beans may offer something different, may be significant to some adjudicators, but not to all. Some people like a more traditional espresso with a good bottom end and should stick with planar or flat plated grinders, and others like a more "transparent" character and may want to spend the extra dosh on a large conical. g) there is a significant price difference between flat plated and conical burred grinders. In commercial use this can be warranted due to the extra long life of the conical burrs, but only an individual can decide whether the price difference is justified for their 2 cups of milk coffee per day at home. h) If the grinder is specced properly for the use intended, "grind retention" realistically becomes a figment of the imagination that is fueled by incessant cyclic discussions, and which makes people needlessly worried and insecure. If you use a doser grinder at home, or a large conical grinder at home, the grind retention that they suffer from is what it is, given you are using a grinder that is designed and built for volume cafe use, not for use in your home. Buy an appropriate grinder, and there wont be a problem. i) anyone contemplating an elektra grinder should seriously consider that for the most part, elektra grinders are a custom body placed straight over a Macap grinder. So only an individual can decide whether they might want to pay say $2.5k or more for a conical elektra, when you can probably have the macap M7K for less than $2k (an educated guess on the prices at this stage but cant be too far out....). j) a lot of BS is oft written about stuff in the internerd and it has the very real effect of manipulating what consumers purchase...often for the wrong reasons, and I have tried to shed some light on stuff above. Also there are a lot of contributors that have a pet brand model and will go all out to defend their pet and tell the world why it is so much better than anything else. This has the very real effect of making many readers that have already bought something different, doubt and feel insecure about their choice, and it also makes new clients very scared of buying the "wrong thing". They will often trust anonymous givers of advice on the www, but not a professional equipment dealer who knows his stuff... This is nothing short of criminal, and has people going into the spiral of "upgradeitis" looking very often, for a kind of grinder or brew Nirvana that simply does not exist....but it is good for the traders selling these items. For all of the above reasons and explanations, buying a grinder can sometimes be made so much more complicated that it really needs to be. Read everything with a grain or two of salt. Sue, if you have an requests for info, feel free to contact me here or elsewhere.

Cuir Beluga · June 2015

Thanks Fresh Coffee I look forward to it

. I figured I may as well give a little run down of things as they stand at the mo.... We are predominantly milky coffee drinkers however each time I make a cuppa I do take a sip of it "neat" hoping to one day decide that espresso ain't all bad

. My palate is probably well, non existent, but I am working on that. I can discern between some notes, just like my perfumery, some notes stand out others are more hidden lurking just beneath, waiting to be discovered but I won't tear my hair out if I "don't get it". Grinder needs to take up a relatively small space. $ wise, I am looking at spending around the $500-$600 mark. Not sure if any of that helps :P.

Brett H · June 2015

Wow... thank you Fresh Coffee! What an incredibly generous post. Thank you :thumb:

GeekKopi · June 2015

Great post Fresh Coffee When I was looking for a grinder one seller tried to push something that I didn't need for home use (and got pissed at them as a result) so I went somewhere else and bought my M2M, which is just what I needed at home. The price was right too. The lesson I learned when looking for a grinder was to be realistic with my usage/needs at home. I do see my needs changing in the future and I might get another grinder when that time comes.

Cuir Beluga · June 2015

Wowee, thank you for that more than helpful post FC. When the time gets a bit closer I think you will be hearing from me

. It looks like a tie between the Mignon and a Macap :thumb:.

kbilleter · June 2015

on 1434339923:

We are predominantly milky coffee drinkers however each time I make a cuppa I do take a sip of it "neat" hoping to one day decide that espresso ain't all bad .

It's probably worth persevering through a whole shot as the scents, flavours, textures and intensity change with the different layers and cooling temperature. I found myself moving to espresso initially to improve the base of my latte as it's harder to improve your shots with the extra factor of milk. Of course, as they get better, you appreciate them more :-)

Cuir Beluga · June 2015

on 1434489790:

It's probably worth persevering through a whole shot as the scents, flavours, textures and intensity change with the different layers and cooling temperature. I found myself moving to espresso initially to improve the base of my latte as it's harder to improve your shots with the extra factor of milk. Of course, as they get better, you appreciate them more :-)

I think you probably are right there kbilleter. Next one is a shot 8).

GeekKopi · June 2015

on 1434498645:

I think you probably are right there kbilleter. Next one is a shot 8).

get your spoon ready Sue. [emoji13]

Moon · June 2015

I must have gotten my wires crossed. I thought Sue had recently purchased a Smart Grinder??

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