Time for an upgrade

Lacehim · June 2016

Having a bad run with Oscar. He just spent a few weeks in the repair shop getting a new Pstat. He's getting a bit old, and is heavily modded (not by me) and I think it's time to move on now that my budget is recovering. To top it off my BSG got jammed and I think one of the cogs inside jumped a few notches and it's grinding way too fine. Grrrr. They look like a PITA to take apart but it's served me well.

Any suggestions for a new machine and grinder? I think a second hand commercial might be ok if I can find a decent one. The machine I wouldn't mind being slightly compact, easy to use HX.

Cuir Beluga · June 2016

Oscar 2 maybe? If they are available here yet. I find them strangely attractive.

Brett H · June 2016

Go the Unico Splendor!

Unknown · June 2016

G'day Lacehim, Where did you take your machine for it's check up and op? It all depends on what you want to spend, clearly we are not talking 'just' another domestic coffee machine with a NS Oscar!

What's your budget on a new machine mate? If you are after a secondhand one I would recommend hospitality auctions, you can find awesome deals! I would also recommend trying the machine before buying it also. I haven't used a BSG since it first came out but loved it then! From what I remember it's not too fiddly but if it's under warranty I wouldn't play around with it. If need be I can ask around and look into some parts for you if you like?

FreshCoffee2 · June 2016

on 1465890833:

............What's your budget on a new machine mate? If you are after a secondhand one I would recommend hospitality auctions, you can find awesome deals! I would also recommend trying the machine before buying it also...........

Some random thoughts on this: I couldn't disagree more in terms of recommending hospitality auctions, unless we know what Lacehim's expertise is at sorting old / obsolete / worn out commercial espresso machines...we would also need to know if Lacehim wants a machine to make coffee with now, or a project of indeterminate length of time to completion. Additionally in terms of budget, the buy price of used hulks at auctions....could if you are lucky be the "make coffee now" price of the machine if it hooks up and works, or if not (lucky) it could be the buy price plus plus plus to get it to the eventual operating price. You only need to buy a machine with an unserviceable brain/CPU/black box, to rake up say an extra minimum of at least $500 just to get the machine operating, to then find it needs a new water pump and motor...retail somewhere around say $1000.00 or more for new (and you would be mad to buy a used pump). Add to that, you cannot hook up an auction machine to see if it is running. Its just a lump of indeterminate condition sitting on a pallet. Buyer beware. So unless Lacehim is prepared for all that, has experience, is looking for a project, is not concerned by blown budgets, has experience buying used commercial machines at auction (as traders do), then I wouldn't be recommending that route for him especially if he has to pay someone to do the work that may be required (in which case it is the cost of parts plus labour...). That is, buying unknowns at auction is for those who are in "the know" and who can deal with all that involves...it's not for everyone in fact, it is only for a select few in the scheme of things. The next idea would be to go see espresso machine traders in your area to see what they have in used commercial machines that are known to be goers and can be hooked up and tried out. Or, you could consider one of the many new semi commercial machines that are available including from some of the sponsors who support this site. Semi commercials don't take up a ton of room, make coffee like commercial machines and run from 10 amp outlets...ie have a hefty convenience factor when compared to dirty old ex cafe machines that need work and more money spent, take up a lot of room and most of which (except for 1 group size) need at least 15 if not 20 amp circuits run to the place where they are to be situated and need water and drain connections... And that brings it right back to the budget. Lacehim, I believe my people may be having some end of year sales and have new BFC semi commercials in various models and small commercial grinders of high quality. There is plenty of stock that needs to be whittled down before stock take time. If you have a budget in mind and want to investigate, dont hesitate to send me a PM and I will arrange for someone to call you with whats on offer. But first note...you need to decide on your budget. All the best

Cuir Beluga · June 2016

on 1465886261:

Go the Unico Splendor!

I can second this 8).

askthecoffeeguy · June 2016

ive bought more than a few semi commercial single group machines from ebay but always tried them out first to ensure that they were in excellent working order and for around $1000 you wind up with a pretty serious piece of hardware that competes well with if not 'better than' the prosumer machines that can be much more expensive ive knocked out 60 coffees / hot chocolates / chais in an hr using my beast of a machine at the school fair - and there's plenty of home user machines that cost three times that price that cant keep up with that kind of punishment... p

FreshCoffee2 · June 2016

Hi Pat, yes but....none of that (use at fetes / "punishment" ) has anything to do with a machine for use at home

It depends entirely on the individual and situation. And may I say....my experience in wholesale and retail in this country, has taught me that people seem to want everything cheap. This is contrary to other markets where people seem to be more prepared to pay for quality....whatever that means in any given situation. So $1000.00 is "better than" $2000.00, simply by virtue of the fact it is cheaper but may not be exactly what someone wanted.....hmmmmm. Lacehim needs to have some kind of an idea of whjat he wants and a budget figure, without which all of this is just another internet discussion

Unknown · June 2016

good point Fresh Coffee! apologies on that I had the help of people in the industry when I sourced mine from an auction. "Lacehim needs to have some kind of an idea of whjat he wants and a budget figure, without which all of this is just another internet discussion" completely agree with that.

askthecoffeeguy · June 2016

true it all comes down to individual preferences Ive bought a bunch of new machines as well including a couple of BFCs, a Kees Van der Westen Triplicate Mirage, and a Bezzera Domus Galatea, so im certainly not adverse to as new purchase - its horses for courses I guess And I very seldom do school fates these days because they're just too much work! But I do appreciate the additional pulling power of a semi commercial machine and its great guns when i have a few mates over for coffee because it copes with the added demand with ease... P

Koffee_Kosmo · June 2016

I think he is missing his lever machines Go a Strega Went to see the new Barazi shop at Wooloongabba last week and kinda thought of upgrading to a Duo Strega (that's Tank / Mains water connectivity ) KK

askthecoffeeguy · June 2016

Have to say that I really enjoyed working on a four group Bosco Lever - despite it being a tricky beast to master, it still made a super awesome espresso, possibly the best extraction I've ever had !

Brett H · June 2016

I like the look of the Strega but there's a group of chaps on another forum that reckon they run hot. I reckon they don't sell them! Seriously Lacheim... Go the Splendor Maxi. Form, function and bullet-proof.

Moon · June 2016

on 1465865820:

Any suggestions for a new machine

PV Lusso :rofl: Going the full circle and returning to your roots. :P

Brett H · June 2016

Returning to my roots would mean trying to milk a Krups thermoblock for black gold. Oh the horror!!

Koffee_Kosmo · June 2016

on 1466075453:

I like the look of the Strega but there's a group of chaps on another forum that reckon they run hot. I reckon they don't sell them! Seriously Lacheim... Go the Splendor Maxi. Form, function and bullet-proof.

What's stopping anyone to have a temp adjustment if ones Strega is truly running hot One thing I fail to understand is that by basing the observation of hot water gush on a straight flush they fail to understand that the whole cylinder chamber needs to fill and as it fills the temp stabilises within milliseconds and then that water is pushed into the coffee puck A lever does NOT operate like an E61 where hot water is immediately pushed into and through the puck Some people are just silly and don't understand the mechanics of the design KK

LeroyC · June 2016

on 1466075453:

I like the look of the Strega but there's a group of chaps on another forum that reckon they run hot. I reckon they don't sell them! Seriously Lacheim... Go the Splendor Maxi. Form, function and bullet-proof.

Stregas look awesome. I came within a bee's proverbial of scoring one for $1500 recently. There's every chance the HX runs a bit hot, but so what?! You either use the machine accordingly or if you want clarity around what you're doing there's any easy PID mod that can be done to them. Ah well, back to dreaming for me.

Lacehim · June 2016

Hi guys, Wow, you got a lot of questions haven't you. Well I live on the Sunshine Coast, QLD so we don't have a lot of choice in terms of businesses I can just walk into and look at some machines. The guy that serviced my Oscar was a company called Govtec (now called EspressoTec I think) down by the airport. He has a lot of machines but mostly big commercial stuff. I think poor Oscar is just a bit old and worn down, or to be honest I would be happy carrying along with him. So this isn't a upgrade because I want an upgrade. As it is he's going back because the steam wand is leaking!

My max budget is probably going to be around $2k (machine and grinder) so I'll probably be looking at pre loved, but like usually for this area, Ebay is devoid of anything that not a Sunbeam or a Breville, or has a stupid price tag on it.

I would prefer a better more commerical grinder than the Breville. The BSG has been good, but one hiccup and it's a write off! I'm looking for a working machine, I don't need another fixer upper, and it doesn't need to be a lever. I love the concept of levers, but big commercial levers are too many $$$ at the moment. I've just moved, my youngest needs a new wheelchair and we have been hoping to get an assistance dog for him so the budget is minimal (Dad's coffee comes last on the proirity list! :laugh: ). I'm really looking for local service and support on this machine. I would love an L1 on the bench after seeing and trying Kelsey's a while ago, but way way way too many $$$.

Brett H · June 2016

Hi L, AM likes the Sunbeam EM7000 and I do too! I enjoyed using it far more than the Breville Dual Boiler. At $479 you just can't go wrong especially if you join the $50 Club and get free shipping on all purchases over 50 for 12 months!! https://m.catchoftheday.com.au/event/top-brand-appliances-53615/product/sunbeam-cafe-series-espresso-machine-red-368366/?st=1&sid=53615

Lacehim · June 2016

on 1466159948:

Hi L, AM likes the Sunbeam EM7000 and I do too! I enjoyed using it far more than the Breville Dual Boiler. At $479 you just can't go wrong especially if you join the $50 Club and get free shipping on all purchases over 50 for 12 months!! https://m.catchoftheday.com.au/event/top-brand-appliances-53615/product/sunbeam-cafe-series-espresso-machine-red-368366/?st=1&sid=53615

Not a fan of the consumer machines. They can be great when they are working, but you have to deal with them direct when they go wrong. Just googling EM7000 gives so many reviews about bad service or having to post it back to get repairs, 2 week waits for new collars. No thanks!

I would rather have a second hand Italian machine any day.

Koffee_Kosmo · June 2016

I think I saw a pre loved 2010 GIA at Barazi when I visited Close to your price range Give Chris a call or if interested I can go to test it out for you KK

Lwowiak · June 2016

on 1466077273:

Some people are just silly and don't understand the mechanics of the design KK

I totally agree with that comment. Some also have a god complex and think that the only machines worth using/owning are the ones that they sell and continuously spruik over and over.........

FreshCoffee2 · June 2016

On the topic of apparent "hot running". A lot of stuff written in forums is outright misleading, and I know I don’t have to tell you that..... Some machines genuinely run hot because they are not well controlled by virtue of their internal design. An operator can work round that, but will use mega gallons of water flushing continually while using the machine over a period. Most machines are reasonably well controlled, and some are very well controlled. Regardless, it is up to the operator to learn how to use his/her machine to best advantage. In Australia, I was one person who pioneered the so called "signature speccing"of semi-commercial machines, to cool them down for non continuous use. "Signature speccing" usually applies to semi-commercial (Italian manufacturer speak) or to use an americanism, "pro-sumer" machines, and is the act of modifying various internal parameters to get a machine that is originally designed and built for continuous (commercial/cafe) use, to work better in non continuous use. Machines designed for continuous use will not run hot when used accordingly, but can “run hot” when not used according to their design brief. This is because in home or office use, they can sit for periods without a throughput of water, and the water inside the circuitry becomes overly hot (ie hotter than it would be when the machine is in continual use and drawing water from the mains or internal reservior). Operators are supposed to flush that through before making their next coffee… Ergo, industry people like me work out how to cool them down for use in that scenario. That works really well for most home or office use, however let’s say someone is having a party with a lot of people, a machine that has been thus controlled may run cool when running off a lot of coffees continually. There is nothing wrong with any of that, because the whole deal has to be a compromise. There are 2 things then to conclude with: a) Some machines really are out of control ie not well designed internally / set up in the first place, but they are not generally liked in these circles, and b) It really is supposed to be the domain of the understanding "barista", to be able to deal with this and work around his equipment and coffee. This is why good espresso making is a bit of a "black art" and can’t be done well by "prescription". Working to a prescription rather than understanding the principles I am sorry to say, renders operators unable to deal with the variables that can and do arise... By and large machines usually sold by sponsors of places like this, are well set up given the compromises mentioned. What I have written above is mostly applicable to heat exchanger machines however the underlying sentiments can be applied to all, and when you read in some forum or other that some machine is said to run hot, you really need to take that with a grain of salt if for no other reason, because you don’t know the bona fides or expertise of the (anonymous) commentators...a machine may or may not genuinely run hot, or the anonymous interweb “barista” making the comment may not be a very good barista or may not understand the concepts or even his machine if it is relatively new to him. So what does it all mean? Suggest for the most part to speak with reputable traders that are actually guaranteeing that what they sell to you is fit for purpose. The rest is just endless chatter in forums....which can often kill the sale of a very good machine, for a sideways move to some other brand machine which in reality may be no better than the first one but has been given a thorough bump up the scale desireability by virtue of all these discussions that make people scared lest the buy the "wrong" thing... Hope that helps.

Brett H · June 2016

on 1466378198:

I totally agree with that comment. Some also have a god complex and think that the only machines worth using/owning are the ones that they sell and continuously spruik over and over.........

Spot on! Thank you FC for again cutting through the chaff!

Kevohere · June 2016

on 1466400504:

Suggest for the most part to speak with reputable traders that are actually guaranteeing that what they sell to you is fit for purpose. The rest is just endless chatter in forums....which can often kill the sale of a very good machine, for a sideways move to some other brand machine which in reality may be no better than the first one but has been given a thorough bump up the scale desireability by virtue of all these discussions that make people scared lest the buy the "wrong" thing... Hope that helps.

Yup, that's sensible reasoning and is applicable to any appliance purchase IMO. Well said FC. (As usual.)

FreshCoffee2 · June 2016

Thanks for the kind thoughts guys. ****************************** I will put this here temporarily because of the topic, then perhaps move it to my sponsor section in a few days.... Guys my people are doing some hot deals on BFC (used to call them Diadema) semi commercial machines and Macap grinders to move stock so they dont have to count it on June 30. Anyone that is interested to know more might contact me by pm and I will put someone in contact with you. Lacehim, I am sending you a PM shortly with some specific information that you may be interested in given what you have written above. A.

Lacehim · June 2016

on 1466507587:

Lacehim, I am sending you a PM shortly with some specific information that you may be interested in given what you have written above. A.

PM received. Will have a chat to the Mrs. Cheers.

Lacehim · July 2016

A dog just stole my budget! :laugh: :rofl: We've been on a waiting list 2 years for a dog and finally we've found one that suits! Yay! Only problem is that it cost $2k which was the money I had set aside for a machine, so I'll have to keep flogging old Oscar for a bit longer! Still the dog is going to be amazing for our family. Life gets a bit expensive when you have kids with disabilities. My wallet always seems to have holes in it! :tearhair:

Lacehim · July 2016

Well today was my lucky day! C-Man spotted an "expresso" machine on Gumtree just around the corner from me. Phoned up, still available due to a time waster! The woman used it in a cafe for a few months and then it did home duties. Tried selling me 8 x 1kg bags of coffee and an EM0700 for another $200 but I turned her down :rofl: So I now own a Bezzera Giulia

:coffee2: Similar to the Mitica model but tank only which is fine considering it has a massive 4lt water tank. Really happy with it, got it home, gave it a clean and took a look inside and it's as clean as a whistle, a 2014 model so will be a whole lot more reliable than old Oscar. Dialed in the grind/dose ok, and pulled some lovely shots, and the steaming is a piece of cake. Now I just need to find a nice grinder for it.

Dry_bean. · July 2016

Well done Lacehim, great machine, well built and very easy to use, The Giulia is another version of the much acclaimed Bezzera Domus Galatea. :thumb:

Koffee_Kosmo · July 2016

Congrats :thumb: You have a very nice and well finished machine May you have many years of faithful service and superb coffee KK

frame

Howdy, Stranger!

Howdy, Stranger!

Categories

In this Discussion

Time for an upgrade

Comments

foot

Policies

Social

frame

Howdy, Stranger!

Howdy, Stranger!

Quick Links

Categories

In this Discussion

Time for an upgrade

Comments

foot

Policies

Social