Grinder Advice - again

Honest_Gaza

I know you guys get asked this all the time....but opinions change, technology changes....but affordability doesn't.

For the new Sunbeam beast I'm currently spending $16 on 250g Illy pre-ground, or $10 on 200g Gloria Jeans shop-ground coffee.

Based on this, I could easily justify to the Missus that $160 for a Grinder would be a worthwhile investment.  Looking through previous threads, it appears the minimum recommended purchase price is approx $260 (Lux Grinder).  Is this still the case ?....or are there cheaper machines that WILL do the job (not interested in machines that MIGHT do the job).

All advice welcome.

mattyj

hmmm ... how about a zassenhaus grinder? http://www.coffeecompany.com.au/Shopping_Cart.php?category=10&main_category=Hardware They're reasonably cheap, and I know of a few people that use them to grind for espresso, with adequate results ... requires some elbow grease, though. I used a delonghi kg100 for about 18 months, and I was able to choke my (older) sunbeam ... but it required tweaking (just adjusting some factory settings ... tweaks that are made to be made) to be able to do so, and seriously decreased the life of the burrs. Otherwise, I've heard of Gaggia MDF grinders doing well ... but they're about $30 over your budget. Maybe check out myers for sales and things like that.

Remus

i have the rocky. can't remember how much it is. i hear the lux is very good though.

Unknown

The Rocky is not a good suggestion based on budget I'm sorry to say.. the cheapest I've seen it is $329.. but you are most likely going to have to fork out $380+   I saw a Rocky (brand new) the other day on eBay go for $415 in an auction.. there are places out there that have them for less than that RRP.. I'd go LUX for the money! Good luck!!

FreshCoffee2

Just a quick word on pricing. Always make sure that the price you obtain has been given in the format designated by the regulating authorities...which is to say in plain Australian English, make sure the trader has complied with regulations by giving you the all up price WHICH INCLUDES GST. Some, in order to try and get clients to contact them first, which is to try and get an advantage over other traders....advertise "bare" prices and that is, the prices BEFORE GST. This is not kosha and as far as I know its actually not legal. So. Anyone advertising a rocky for "329" is either unprofessional and breaking the rules OR is an outright fool because there is no point in running a business where no profit is made. The RRP of Rocky is $439.00 as far as am aware. That's 399 PLUS GST (and lets not forget PLUS FREIGHT for mail orders), for traders that are trying to hoodwink someone into contacting them first for advantage. But it sure sounds like the grinder only costs 399 doesn't it?  ;D Just some thoughts. Regardz, FC.

mattyj

So I guess that all of this kind of says that you may need to consider spending more $$$ if you want a grinder that WILL do the job. Someone once told me that an espresso machine is simply an accessory to a good grinder. My experience has testified to this - that I could get 'pretty good' coffee out of an old sunbeam with a delonghi grinder, and 'fantastic' coffee out of the same machine with a mazzer mini (...and even better coffee with a better machine!). A friend of mine was using the same delonghi grinder with a Bezzera machine, and even though I've only made coffee with him twice, the last time I saw him, he'd upgraded his grinder to something more capable of working well with a good machine. In time, I've come to realise that control over the grind is one of the most important factors in getting good espresso - if the grind is way off, or uneven, or whatever, it can really ruin an otherwise great coffee.

FreshCoffee2

I just tell my clients to think of Hi-Fi.... You can buy a $10,000.00 amplifier. But of you feed the expensive high end amp a signal from a crappy source like a $50.00 CD player what do you get? You get very clear amplification of a low quality sound

Remus

i dunno. i'm not as big on it and i don;t actually think it's as important. you guys are the experts i suppose so i'm not saying i;m right, just talking from my experience. i've done grinds in my old gaggia and in my new rocky and i can;t tell the difference in the end product. i doubt anyone could. the differnce from my end is in the quality of the product aswell as better functionality and probably longevity.

Honest_Gaza

Thanks for the input guys. FC...in the case of the Hi-Fi stereo analogy, I agree.  But you have mentioned a $10,000 Amp with a $50 CD player.  This is perhaps a little too simplistic. In the real world, your average home Hi-Fi enthusisast might pay $700 for an Amp and $300 for a DVD player.  The point being that the extremes you have mentioned would be unlikely.  I am trying to ascertain at which point (read $$$), does a grinder move from being an Amp with Dolby Pro-Logic to an Amp with Dolby Digital.....with low distortion levels. Keeping in mind, some people have suggested on various threads that you should pay more for a Grinder than you do for the Coffee Machine. What seems to be the message so far is that for approx $260-$270, the Lux would be the starting point.

Remus

i think thats about right gaza. around the $300 mark is gonna get you outta trouble mate.  

FreshCoffee2

G'day HG, re "...Keeping in mind, some people have suggested on various threads that you should pay more for a Grinder than you do for the Coffee Machine...." I think the above way of putting it (and I have seen it done several times in this and other forums) is not quite right. Taking the comment on face value, it is entirely dependent on the coffee machine you intend to buy (or already have). For me it is a lot more simple. I know you can use a Lux grinder quite successfully with a 2500 dollar esp machine, amd you can use a 700 grinder with a 69 dollar sunbeam. Which coffee is going to be better.....the coffee made with the 2500 machine with lux grinder, not the other made with the cheap machine and exi grinder. It is more a question of matching a machine and grinder together. Placing the 69 machine mentioned above with say, a 160 dollar solis type grinder will be an excellent matchup. Placing that 69 dollar machine with the 90 dollar emide grinder is not going to be the best matchup but will be better than using pre ground. The 90 dollar grinder does not really cut it in terms of grind quality ( consistency of particle size). On the other hand someone that purchases a 2500 machine should correctly match it with a small commercial grinder. Why, because the machine is also a small commercial machine...,Ergo, you buy either of the 700 dollar Macap M5 or Mini Mazzer. But you dont NEED to do that because you may happily exist with the lux at below 300 dollars...I am talking in terms of grind quality only. So beware the recommendations to buy expensive grinders, as they are not really based on fact...just equipment snobbery "per se". This is by no means intended to be a reflection on anything or anyone participating in this excellent forum, only a reflection on the fact that it is easy to get carried away in these sites.... So yes, the lux is a good match for your machine and in fact if you ever upgrade, from the point of grind quality only it may well remain a "good" grinder for more expensive equipment. Please note I am not trying to build a case for the lux, but is a convenient starting point for a "good" grinder based on budget...otherwise if budget were not an issue I wouldn't hesitate to spend more money and get a really nice solid grinder. Not necessarily because I might think that a more expensive heavier grinder is going to give a better grind quality "per se", but because there are other issues and I am also a sucker for nice heavy solid equipment! Regardz, FC.

Honest_Gaza

Thanks Remus & FC....just got to work on the wife a little to raise my budget.

mattyj

....just got to work on the wife a little to raise my budget.

(chuckling to myself) ... been there. All I can say is, good luck, and I hope your lounge is good for sleeping on!

Remus

great post FC.

Remus

Someone once told me that an espresso machine is simply an accessory to a good grinder..

lol that bloke just happened to be a grinder salesman. ;D

Reschsmooth

Honest Gaza - "Thanks Remus & FC....just got to work on the wife a little to raise my budget" As I have said elsewher, forgiveness is easier to get than permission    ;D

mattyj

lol that bloke just happened to be a grinder salesman. ;D

If he was, he would have been a good one! There's still times when I remember thinking '$600 for a coffee grinder?!? that's a bit over-the-top, isn't it?' But then I pull another shot

Remus

As I have said elsewher, forgiveness is easier to get than permission

Honest_Gaza

As I have said elsewher, forgiveness is easier to get than permission

Reschsmooth

Don't forget, I disclaim absolutely all and any liability or responsibility for any damage that may result to you or your person as a result of any action you may take directly or indirectly influenced or directed from my previous comments. Having said that, go for it...get the best and biggest grinder you think you can get away with 8)

mattyj

Probably best to make sure I score that night, buy the grinder the next day, and stay away from BNT catalogues for a few weeks

Lovey

G'day all, Honest Gaza, how's the grinder hunting going?   Are you still on speaking terms with your SO? Let us know how you went on both fronts. Steve.

Honest_Gaza

Hi Lovey, The hunt for the grinder continues.  It looks like the Lux is the way to go.  Just stalking my prey and waiting to pounce. The same goes for the grinder  ;D

Honest_Gaza

Just watched the bidding on E-Bay for a Lux Grinder.....went for approx $250 including postage.  So much for big savings on E-Bay.

Lovey

G'day Honest Gaza, if you've got your heart set on the Lux, give Fresh Coffee a ring and see what he can do for you.  He may not be as 'cheap' as ebay, (which as you've found out, isn't that cheap at all) but you can't put a dollar value on the knowledge and after sales service that he can provide. Besides, while you're looking around for the best price, you're wasting valuable coffee preparation and drinking time. All the best, Steve.

Honest_Gaza

Yes, I've been in contact with FC and will probably source the Grinder from him.  Just waiting for the right moment to place an order.

inertia8

I too now have the dilemma of which grinder... I am using a Saeco Via Venezia at the moment and have been saving for a grinder. Now it comes time to purchase and that $400 is looking at me and saying "you sure you want to give ALL of me away to the coffee shop?"... I know at some point I will get a better machine, but for now the VV does just fine, just whether to get a LUX or Rocky or Solis Maestro Plus is a hard decision...

mcraeotb

i only just took a 2 hour course in using a coffee machine... so i havent really got one right now, i just use a plunger, still... but what ive learnt is do it till u think its right, then ask someone if it looks right if they say yes, make the coffee for them ask them if its bad and if it is, take a bit longer and ask them if they are sure cause its their coffee  

Lovey

G'day Inertia8,

I know at some point I will get a better machine, but for now the VV does just fine, just whether to get a LUX or Rocky or Solis Maestro Plus is a hard decision...

I think you answered your own question in relation to the choice of grinder. If you know you want to upgrade in the future, and who doesn't  ;D, I'd get the best grinder you can afford, which IMH(Humble)O is the Rocky out of the group you mentioned.  It is a proven performer and is built like a tank, and it would most likely see you through most bouts of upgradeitis. All the best, Steve.

Honest_Gaza

Made the big purchase this week.  Got a lovely new Solis Maestro Plus 167 model. Turned it on this evening, ground some beans, shoved it under the Sunbeam 6900 and prayed. Crema first time !!!!! Tried it a second time and same result!!!! Just have to buy some new lightbulbs now (kitchens aren't designed for summersaults). This machine was sourced through one of the regulars on this site.  Helpful advice over the phone, easy payment options, prompt delivery....and a working machine to boot. I'm not sure of the forum rules in regards to advertising etc, so I'm not sure if names can be used. Anyway, I'm sure that FC would agree that this is a pretty nifty little grinder.  

Reschsmooth

HG Admin can correct me if I am wrong, but feel free to list the name of the helpful supplier - generally these guys who supply and provide good service participate often on here, and more often than not, in their own time and offer great advice. They generally deserve a bit of praise. P