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Ponte Vecchio Lusso - Seal change HELP?

2

Comments

  • Ponte Vecchio tell me that it is normal for the Group seal to fall out when the shower screen is not attached as it is its job to hold it in place. They also said that after a few uses the seal will sit in properly. So far the coffees have not been good using the new seal. In December I will have had the PV Lusso for 3 years. Maybe it is time to say goodbye to the lever and say hello to an e61 group machine. This one ----> http://rocket-espresso.com/appartamento.html
  • Get a Strega You won't look back KK
  • It was my ideal machine at the height of my lever love .. which has slightly diminished of late  :-X The Strega is an extra $800 @ $3,400 I could go the extra $250-300 for the Rocket Giotto PID V3 @ $2,850/900 ... only what is the advantage? I'd want more than just bells and whistles I look at these machines .. then my Lusso .. and think .. yeah, it's a bit of a toy machine .. I do really need to step up and upgrade sometime Must admit though - I usually do opt for the extra and get the better model. You soon forget the $ .. and feel good about your decision every time you look at it. My next outing places more priority on purchasing locally for convenience.. so that I can drop it off for repair, standard sized parts, availability, local repairs/service for a Brand name they are aware of .. and a seller who offers good customer service .. and of course .. a good price. I'm a reasonable fella... all I'm asking is for my Coffee Machine to be reliable .. and provide me with a very nice coffee .. and if things break down - it gets fixed without too much delay .. that is all :P ps. Anyone offering a deal on a Strega that is too good to refuse??
  • No.... seriously though.  If you're in the market for a new machine you'd be barking mad not to talk to Fresh Coffee.  Seriously, don't ask the interwebs, ask a the best professional retailer.  Their entire reputation and livelihood relies on happy customers.
  • Shame Fresh Coffee/ Cosmorex is in the ACT and I'm in Melbourne I've bean looking around .. and I gotta tell yer ... I've got a craving for this Baby It is a noisy video .. but sheesh ... all class *ECM Technika 1V Profi ..... tell me that ain't a sweet looking piece of gear .. bit like Jennifer Hawkins Looking under the cover in some of those videos .. they are high quality components. This one has a SS boiler. Either that or the *Profitec Pro 500 I don't think Site Sponsors have these 2 machines ... sofar - it seems only the d00d in Beaumaris has them in Melbourne
  • Thanks for the huge plug Brett, appreciate that. And now for some musings from someone that has spent a lifetime in the import, sales and service of machines and grinders... Personally, I find the more you (I) chase bells and whistles outwards and around, the more it brings you back to good old, safe, tried and proven equipment made by good name manufacturers. As you can imagine, I've had quite a few different model machines over the years, and they have all taken me back to my current "simple" E61 heat exchanger ("HX") machine. The only whim I've given in to, is to have a model with a rotary pump instead of a vibrating solenoid pump, and it is certainly smoother and quieter in operation. What does it do? What does any well made coffee machine do? It makes excellent quality brew (insert here dependent on expertise of the driver) with little to no fuss. That's it. End of story. How many coffees a day do I make on average for my investment (say at new equipment cost of roughly 2.5 thou machine and 1 thou grinder = 3.5 thou)...4 a day (2 for me and 2 for spouse).  Should I spend more to buy more bells and whistles to get no appreciable difference in either brew or ease of use and reliability?  Only an individual can say for themselves... The rest is all internet fueled mumbo jumbo marketing hype disguised as internet reviews..designed to drive people to buy someone's pet brand instead of another brand...and all the angst that causes, when people reading reviews, become very insecure lest they might purchase the "wrong" machine / model / brand. Focus on the important things. Long standing importer / vendor / brand? Service availability? Ability to be serviced easily by others? Demonstrably, a "good machine"?  Good price? anything else is just icing. If we run side by side blind tests on you (or any number of consumers) to pick the difference in overall performance and quality of coffees made from different brand/model semi commercial machines in a range of prices from say 2 to 5 thou thou, will anyone be able to pick differences and if so what do the differences mean? If differences are found, will they be significant enough to justify large differences in price? I guess it depends on the individual... Moon, if you want to explore something with me, I am here. If you want to explore something elsewhere, no problem, just try not to get sucked into hype which is designed to manipulate your buying choices and drive you to certain brands, or to spend lots of money on intangible dangling carrots.
  • Thanks FC for sharing your experience over many years. Looking back at my decision to get the Ponte Vecchio Lusso 3 years ago was heavily influenced by reading Jack from Sorrentina's reviews/posts on these machines that he had been importing and selling .. along with his ongoing assistance with advice and parts when issues arose. Unfortunately, Jack appears no longer available to help out with these machines. The journey started with an el cheapo Krups hand me down, then to a $200 Sunbeam .. a few 2nd hand Gaggia Babies .. then the PV Lusso which I imported from Italy .. as none were available in Australia at the time from Sorrentina. It was a leap into entry lever machines which had taken my fancy at the time. Although I don't regret getting one, as it has been an interesting phase of the Coffee journey ... I now realise the importance of purchasing your Coffee machine and Grinder from a local business .. as you will at some stage require after sales service .. or perhaps a repair under warranty. These days .. I prefer to leave repairs to people with expertise, who know what they are doing, and who can get the problem fixed. Unfortunately, with the Lusso .. I had no choice .. and we all know how that turned out.  :head:
    After reading up around the traps .. the choice of a new machine had narrowed to 3 machines 1. ECM Technika 1V Profi 2. Profitec Pro 500 3. Rocket Appartamento Each of these are e61 single boiler HX machines ranging in price between $2.6k - $3k General consensus when it comes to choosing which one is better - is that all 3 are high quality machines and that you would be very happy with any of them. There are some differences in the internals .. and appearance .. and it comes down to personal preference. They often suggest, having narrowed the choice down to 3 .. to go into a shop and try them out .. as one in particular may appeal. What do I like more about the ECM? * Option of rotary pump (and plumbed in down the track) - yep ... this is a $300 dangling carrot * Stainless Steel boiler - I do have doubts about Copper. Are your saucepans that you cook with .. Copper, aluminium, or SS? * Internal layout is less congested than the Rocket .. less to go wrong and easier access to repair. I do like simplicity. * Boiler has Insulation (as does Profitec) Rocket doesn't. I like seeing designers going the extra yard .. 1%. Heat in the box is not good for the electrics * Knobs and lever design - I appreciate a design that is different from the 'norm' - Very appealing * ECM round the edges of the SS casing more... reducing the effect of being box shaped. As with the general consensus ... who wouldn't be happy with either of those? I'd probably be happy with a machine that was $1k cheaper .. that still made a great coffee .. but then ... why settle for a Hyundai .. when you can have a BMW  8)
  • All good machines Moony!  Add an Unico Splendor to your list because the marginally smaller boiler will suit you power bill better without any noticeable loss in performance.  The benefit of this machine is that it looks better than most machines and costs a bit less.  Did I just suggest upgrading your grinder too........ ? In for a penny, in for a pound!!  P.s I miss my Splendor!
  • After using and owning a few machines I don't think I would go back to another machine after using a lever KK
  • on 1476872346:
    Add an Unico Splendor to your list
    1. ECM Technika 1V Profi 2. Profitec Pro 500 3. Rocket Appartamento
    on 1476872346:
    Because the marginally smaller boiler will suit you power bill better without any noticeable loss in performance. 
    It is a consideration .. What is it .. a 2.1 ltr boiler v 1.3 ltr The PV Lusso had a 3 ltr boiler but I only put enough filtered water into it for my 1 Coffee .. which would only take 13 odd mins to heat up. That's either being scungy or smart .. I like to think the latter. On the very odd occasion when I goofed it ----> sinker .. I paid  :doh:
    on 1476872346:
    The benefit of this machine is that it looks better than most machines and costs a bit less.
    At $2.5k ... there's $100 - $500 (If I were to go the rotary pump version with the plumbed option?) Cheers for thinking of my hip pocket ..... oh waite  :question:
    on 1476872346:
    Did I just suggest upgrading your grinder too........ ?
      Compak K3 Touch+  :question: C'mon ... you are not suggesting I get one of those humungus commercial types .. that were never meant to go on someones Kitchen bench? Spose there's no other half to veto the idea ... with a 'No way you are clogging up my kitchen bench with that monstrosity' 'Make a decision .. it's me, your loving treasured Wife or your Coffee gear .. your call?' err .... umm I'm trying to hang on to the idea that the Compak is fine .. you know, upgrade Coffee machine .. grinder not necessary  :angel: But seriously .. experts? Will the Compak do the new machine justice .. or is an upgrade inevitable  :question:
  • on 1476874137:
    After using and owning a few machines I don't think I would go back to another machine after using a lever KK
    It's funny .. here I am .. so close to be able to get the dream lever -->Strega .. and I may very well pass it by for an e61 Hx dream machine. You'd really want the 2 different type of machines side by side and try both coffees to compare the difference to see if you preferred one method of coffee extraction over the other ... the flavour in the cup Problem is - the sellers of the ECM that I'm interested in ... don't also sell the Bezzera Strega .. not in Melbourne I know I've previously said that in the past I have held off and gone for the more expensive model .. only $3k is a huge stretch for me .. and the upper limit. There are plenty of Coffee machines in the $2.5 - 3k range that produce a great coffee. I don't really need to go above that. I was originally thinking up to $2.6k .. so I have extended this by $400 already ... another $400 extension??
  • My advice is to go test the machines in your short list Add the Strega to your list Then take your grinder with you, don't forget to also take some coffee beans of your choice and test all machines for suitability, as its the only way you will have a point of reference to judge all the test machines in your short list KK
  • All these (new) e61 HX machines will make an equivalent coffee. It will come down to ease of use / external design set out, size of drip trays (small drips trays are a pitta), whether group handles are straight or angled, strength of steam output, type of steam tip, amount of vibration from water pump, cool touch pipes or not, size of cup tray on top, method of filling the internal reservoir, corrosion proofed chassis or painted etc etc etc. ie personal preferences of an individual, the "icing" mentioned above. That said....the thing about "choice" is, that any particular individual can and may decide that while one model may offer him some extra feature that he likes, it isn't worth (to him) paying the difference in price between it and some other reasonably equivalent model. So budget VS features is very important. EG, while I would pay more for a model with a larger drip tray, someone else might not consider it important enough to pay more...(until they find out how much of a pitta small drip trays are in effectively "portable" machines that do not have a drain to the plumbing...). As an individual, I would also pay more for a machine with better steam valves. How does an individual assess that, if he is not in the know? What you cant test is availability / ease of service / quality of internals = reliability over time and "quality" of the local service provider. What you also cannot test is the difference between a machine that has been tested (and selected) as a result of a demo/test in someone's showroom, and a brand new "in the box" machine taken home as a result of that demo/test. EG....an individual machine may test nicely in the showroom, however a new in the box machine taken home, may vibrate more (or seem to) than the demo machine, due to individual standard of build.... Ultimately, if you want exactly what you selected in a demo at the retailer's, you may wish to buy the demo off the floor and take that. And may I say, there is absolutely nothing wrong with that if the price is adjusted and you have a full guarantee on the machine. Ultimately, this exercise can be as difficult or as easy as an individual wishes to make it. Just some salient points.. oh yes PS...above somewhere you mentioned the grinder and you also mentioned that you are stretched on the budget for the machine.....in which case for the moment my advice is to stay with your current grinder which is perfectly adequate to the job. When you have money to spend on some kind of "upgrade", you will need to do a side by side test between your current grinder and whatever could be a contender, and see what the difference in price offers you as an individual.  IE is the cost of the "upgrade" justifiable to you as in individual, for the return that the upgraded grinder will give you.
  • Cheers for the info .. FC .. much appreciated. Deciding on the dream Coffee machine is a big deal ... even though I'm sure I will be happy with any of this lot I prefer a Stainless Steel boiler over a Copper one .. and a quiet rotary pump over a vibratory .. although I don't know whether I would actually want to plumb the machine in the future. The Profitec Pro 500 has a vibratory pump but due to the design .. they have rubber mounts which makes it quiet. Then there is the Domestic Mater PStat versus the commercial Sirai one. Also things like access to the boiler pressure adjustment if I need to adjust it, etc. I'm wondering .. once these Brands are out of warranty .. how do they compare with cost of parts replacement/repairs? In one of the reviews .. a bloke bought an ECM Technika - and is now finding out the cost of accessories and parts are outrageously excessive for the ECM brand. I'd like to know how Profitec and Rocket compare? I rang a repair Man today to get the rundown .. haven't heard back yet. Another was saying he intended getting an ECM Technika .. only 2 of his mates had one .. and both are having an issue with the steam wand levers leaking. It seems like one machine doesn't tick all of the boxes. Each has what appeals more over the other. But of course - at the end of the day ... and especially at the start - they all make great coffee  :thumb:
  • The only service / repairs I have done to my Strega is 1 X Group Head seal  :thumb: Length of ownership is 5 or 6 years ( gotta check ) And I use one of those aftermarket extra fine group head screens One area of service I never missed with the E61 type machines, is chemical cleaning With the Strega, no chemical flushing / cleaning is required KK
  • Some further points in reply: Cheers for the info .. FC .. much appreciated. You're welcome  :) Deciding on the dream Coffee machine is a big deal ... even though I'm sure I will be happy with any of this lot Yes I prefer a Stainless Steel boiler over a Copper one .. and a quiet rotary pump over a vibratory .. although I don't know whether I would actually want to plumb the machine in the future. The Profitec Pro 500 has a vibratory pump but due to the design .. they have rubber mounts which makes it quiet. Then there is the Domestic Mater PStat versus the commercial Sirai one. Also things like access to the boiler pressure adjustment if I need to adjust it, etc. a) Trust me...you actually DONT want a stainless steel boiler. Additionally, some machines may have a copper boiler that has been "tinned" (on the OUTSIDE) and you may think it is stainless steel when it isnt. .....b) they ALL have rubber mounts, but in the individual build of any particular machine, it may end up with the pump being situated very close to the body OR having been done up in some kind of tension and it will vibrate badly...rubber mounts of themselves do NOT guarantee that a vibrating pump fitment will not make excessive noise from vibration...c) its only my opinion but plumbing "per se" is vastly overrated and overblown in internet discussions,  for home use situations, and most machines that are sold with facility to plumb in.....will NEVER get done....check the reservoir every time you make coffee and it will never be a problem...d) basic mater pressurestat? Forget it dont waste your time I suggest go for the mid sized sirai OR the full commercial sized pressurestat every time or you will be back to have the pressurestat replaced within the period of guarantee which is a waste of time for both parties (client and vendor)...e) access to boiler presure adjuster..another vastly overrated overblown internet discussion thing. It should be set correctly upon delivery and will seldom need to be adjusted, call me pedantic if you like but i have less patience than ever with BS from internet reviews written by people "needing" access to non user serviceable/adjustable parts of any form of equipment. The chances are the thing will never need adjusting until it is replaced and it will be done by the service provider... I'm wondering .. once these Brands are out of warranty .. how do they compare with cost of parts replacement/repairs? Up to the individual service provider In one of the reviews .. a bloke bought an ECM Technika - and is now finding out the cost of accessories and parts are outrageously excessive for the ECM brand. I'd like to know how Profitec and Rocket compare? I rang a repair Man today to get the rundown .. haven't heard back yet. You probably wont because it is an impossible question dependent on individual breakdown history of individual machines of different ages and use and anyone that replies will only be giving you lip service.... Another was saying he intended getting an ECM Technika .. only 2 of his mates had one .. and both are having an issue with the steam wand levers leaking. Yup, another obviously believable internet review. It seems like one machine doesn't tick all of the boxes. Each has what appeals more over the other. Sure But of course - at the end of the day ... and especially at the start - they all make great coffee  :thumb: [/quote] Mate I will be happy to arrange for my people to deliver a BFC Junior Elite machine (same as my home model) to you to demo in your home for a week and see what you think. If you dont like it when compared to the machines you test out in the field, you can return it. There will of course be certain conditions attached.... My people will give you unconditional guarantee that if you dont like it, you can return it for a full refund of the cost of the machine, as long as it is returned in the same condition as it was provided to you, freight and insurance excluded. I cant do any more than that. Cheers, Attilio.
  • Crickey... that's service for ya! 
  • on 1476948860:
    The only service / repairs I have done to my Strega is 1 X Group Head seal  :thumb: Length of ownership is 5 or 6 years
    Close enough. Had a great run .. although I doubt there is a Coffee Machine in Oz that would get looked after as well as yours. That Strega of yours certainly hit the Jackpot when you purchased it. After 5-6 years .. I'll bet anyone seeing it for the first time would think you'd just bought it. Seems the e61 Hx machines take 35 - 45 mins to heat up. The Strega is a lot quicker than that. It's hard to get my head around getting up in the morning, turning the machine on .. and then waiting 3/4 of an hour before you can make your coffee  :tearhair: I'd need a remote or something for when I wake up .. and then set the alarm on my phone to go off 40 mins later.  ??? Tbh .. I seemed to have lost my passion for the lever machines. I was thinking .. even if the Bezzera sponsor showed up and offered a super sweet deal that brought the Strega into line with the others on the list ... I'd consider it ... but it wouldn't be a slam dunk. So as it stands .. I wouldn't be putting my house on a Strega finding a new home in Werribee.
    Now .. over to Fresh Coffee ... I hadn't connected the dots that FC was Attilio. FC - Trust me...you actually DONT want a stainless steel boiler. M - Then why do the cheaper models have a Copper boiler and the more expensive models have Stainless Steel? It doesn't make sense to put non-preferred or inferior boilers in your premium models. Is this just a gimmick? FC - they ALL have rubber mounts. You'd think so ... only side by side the Profitec was quiet whereas the Rocket with the same vibration pump was markedly noisier in the 'Whole Latte Love' comparison video. More thought - better design to the Profitec? FC - for home use situations, and most machines that are sold with facility to plumb in.....will NEVER get done M - Good call .. so getting the rotatary pump would only be for quietness ... or get the Profitec .. and save the extra $ FC - basic mater pressurestat? Forget it dont waste your time I suggest go for the mid sized sirai OR the full commercial sized pressurestat every time or you will be back to have the pressurestat replaced M - Yep ... I have been reading that it happens .. even though the Mater Pstat is relatively inexpensive to replace .. it is annoying & inconvenient FC - access to boiler presure adjuster..another vastly overrated overblown internet discussion thing. It should be set correctly upon delivery and will seldom need to be adjusted M - My PV Lusso had a reputation for being set too high/hot .. and was universally recommended to turn it down before first using .. which I did. With these machines .. they are bench tested by sellers (is this std?) I would have to ask about this when purchasing. FC - You probably wont because it is an impossible question dependent on individual breakdown history of individual machines M - Out of the short list .. he only stocks the Rocket as far as I know .. sent email with questions .. I think he repairs all brands .. need to find out more .. It is not unreasonable to expect a repair tech, or the owner who buys and bills .. to know whether a brand stands out as more expensive with their parts than the others, imo .. although the default would be that they are much the same. I'm looking for the markedly inflated here. FC - I will be happy to arrange for my people to deliver a BFC Junior machine the same as my home model to you to use in your home for a week and see what you think Thanks for the offer Attilio .. I've looked at the Diademas .. and they appear to have a reputation for being well constructed. I have checked them out .. and have considered them as a contender for an upgrade. During that time the Strega was No1 As they say .. beauty is in the eyes of the beholder - aesthetically .. they don't do it for me .. but they obviously do for you and Brett .. and that's all good. No doubt they make a great coffee... as do many others in the price bracket. Some say they are underrated Thanks heaps for the tips .. it has cleared up a few decisions there. Still pondering on the SS boiler thing. Anyone else have thoughts on this one? Apologies Brettmate .. you and KK have helped out a lot since I've been around here  :thumb: I'm fussy. Choosing a new Girlfriend that you get very involved and intimate with is very much a personal thing. It is a long-term romance/love affair - so you need to choose carefully the model that will produce the elixir of life that will not only sustain you .. it will make you happy and bring a smile on your face every time you get to do the Tango together. lol
  • Seems the e61 Hx machines take 35 - 45 mins to heat up...It's hard to get my head around getting up in the morning, turning the machine on .. and then waiting 3/4 of an hour before you can make your coffee.... Another internet furphy I'm afraid...
    FC - Trust me...you actually DONT want a stainless steel boiler. M - Then why do the cheaper models have a Copper boiler and the more expensive models have Stainless Steel? It doesn't make sense to put non-preferred or inferior boilers in your premium models. Is this just a gimmick? I did say "trust me"... ;) The retail prices of machines do not reflect the cost of the individual parts they are made from, prices are reflective of market forces. Copper boilers are NOT inferior to stainless steel boilers, and copper is actually the preferred material. FC - they ALL have rubber mounts. You'd think so ... only side by side the Profitec was quiet whereas the Rocket with the same vibration pump was markedly noisier in the 'Whole Latte Love' comparison video. More thought - better design to the Profitec? Hopefully you are not buying a machine on the basis of a video, because as I stated in the previous post it depends on the individual build of any particular machine... I bet if you put 2 machines of exactly the same model next to each other, one will be noisier than the other and that will just prove my point. FC - for home use situations, and most machines that are sold with facility to plumb in.....will NEVER get done M - Good call .. so getting the rotatary pump would only be for quietness ... or get the Profitec .. and save the extra $ Mate if you are going to keep throwing the names of competing brands to my own into the discussion, then as a paying sponsor of this forum I will have to reply to your comment with this blatant plug of my own...."NO...I would  buy the BFC Junior Elite kindly offered to you on appro by moir..."  M - Out of the short list .. he only stocks the Rocket as far as I know .. sent email with questions .. I think he repairs all brands .. need to find out more .. It is not unreasonable to expect a repair tech, or the owner who buys and bills .. to know whether a brand stands out as more expensive with their parts than the others, imo .. although the default would be that they are much the same. I'm looking for the markedly inflated here. Mate, service techs get paid on "billable hours" and don't get paid for spending time talking to people in what are essentially sales related enquiries, and I already answered the question. In fact if you ask three different service companies, you may get 3 different answers because they will all have their preferred brands and models and suppliers that they like to deal with, especially if they are an actual authorised service agent for a particular brand in which case that will be their preferred brand... Also if they have problems with some suppliers/brands and they are a professional outfit they will not say something to favour one brand over another...So trying to find out this information will not necessarily help you with factual information and could even get you BS information. FC - I will be happy to arrange for my people to deliver a BFC Junior machine the same as my home model to you to use in your home for a week and see what you think Thanks for the offer Attilio .. I've looked at the Diademas .. and they appear to have a reputation for being well constructed. I have checked them out .. and have considered them as a contender for an upgrade. During that time the Strega was No1 As they say .. beauty is in the eyes of the beholder - aesthetically .. they don't do it for me .. but they obviously do for you and Brett .. and that's all good. No doubt they make a great coffee... as do many others in the price bracket. Some say they are underrated As a member of this forum you have been offered an unbelievable "in your own home demo" deal to try before you buy, where you will see the model in the flesh rather than in a photo, and be able to use it. If that does not suit its ok. Thanks heaps for the tips .. it has cleared up a few decisions there. Still pondering on the SS boiler thing. Thankyou, and remember the SS boiler thing is nothing more than a "furphy". Anyone else have thoughts on this one? M: ...choose carefully the model that will produce the elixir of life that will not only sustain you .. it will make you happy and bring a smile on your face every time you get to do the Tango together. Sure
  • and for those people who are not familiar with specific Australianisms / ozspeak: "...Furphy..." A noun meaning a rumour or story, especially one that is untrue or absurd....
  • on 1477002602:
    Mate if you are going to keep throwing the names of competing brands to my own into the discussion, then as a paying sponsor of this forum I will have to reply to your comment with this blatant plug of my own...."NO...I would  buy the BFC Junior Elite kindly offered to you on appro by moir..." 
    Apologies .. I have noticed the name Attilio being mentioned on the forum in the past but didn't connect it to your user name Fresh Coffee. I also didn't connect the name Fresh Coffee to Cosmorex or Bean Roasters .. nor did the word 'sponsor' under your user name click.  :pan <-- me Adding to this lack of observation on my part - is that when I have gone to the Bean Roasters website .. I thought they only roasted and supplied coffee beans. When going to the Cosmorex website, again just now .. I read the small print, and in amongst it .. it happens to mention that Cosmorex sells Coffee Machines. Normally, when going to websites .. it is made more obvious that a Company sells machines with a button in the menu .. along with ''Home' 'About' Coffee Machines' 'Accessories' 'Contact' etc I had no idea that you sell Diadema Coffee machines or any other brands until you offered to arrange to drop one off for a trial in the post above. I thought you were a Coffee Bean Guru .. and when generously offering your assistance about aspects in different machines .. I took you up on it to help decide on which machine in my short list to get. This is most appreciated .. but I did not realize that although you have a Diadema yourself .. as does Brett .. and obviously thrilled with them .. that by mentioning and discussing my early preferences in my short list .. I was offending you .. and for that I apologise. I was not aware of the Brands of Coffee Machines that you sell .. and simply assumed that I could explore you knowledge generally.. which you invited me to do. I've bean a bit reluctant to overdo it .. but I really should wear my reading glasses more often ... I'm missing too much  :lamp: Man ... I really need a Coffee machine ... the withdrawals are killing me  >:D Earl Grey tea just ain't cutting it.
  • Shortlist Update 1. Bezzera Strega 2. Rocket Evoluzione Giotto V2 3. Profitec Pro 500 4. Rocket Appartamento Hmm .. I can feel the lever love creeping back through my veins Game changers 1. e61 HX machines take 45 mins to heat up. Strega takes 15 mins. That's an extra 1/2 hour of torture every morning for the Zombie to endure before getting his first fix for the day. It matters. 2. Tasting all these Coffees in Cafes that use La Marzoccos and the like .. + huge Mazzer Grinders with their experienced Baristas rarely produce a latte that rates better than a 9.2/10 imho .. and that's the better Coffees. Even with my cheap lever - PV Lusso .. in its heyday could produce better Coffee according to my taste buds with scores of 9.2 9.3 9.4 For some reason .. in the last 6-12 months .. I hadn't bean able to get a Coffee up past a 9.2/10 .. but that was still very good. Although I admit that I don't have an educated palate .. Coffees from one of these e61 Machines all seem to produce a 1 layered flavour (occasionally 2) with better body than what I can produce on my small lever machine. It is like the extraction of flavour is all at one speed that is abundant with one particular flavour that the beans are offering .. whereas a lever extracts the flavours at different speeds and temperature which captures more of the range on offer .. therefore producing a shot with more layers. I have never tasted the exotic flavours that my lever machine was able to extract .. in a Cafe made Coffee... umm .. maybe once I did .. and that was quite a pleasant surprise at the time. The Cafe produced Coffee does have a rich tan/chocolatey colour which does look impressive in the cup. I could never produce this on my lever ... but then .. appearance does count .. but nowhere near as much as taste.  :coffee2: Copper boiler - from further reading .. there are claims that the copper in the boiler (and therefore tubes) acts as a microbial inhibitor .. which makes sense .. as Copper is used on plants/fruit trees to kill mould and fungal infestations. Sounds like a good thing to me.  :thumb:       
  • Moony Ol Chap. The Expobar Minore IV is not on your list - probably because people have become bored with it's efficiency and reliability, or perhaps it's the dated styling and finish. Despite all the intense energy focused on the new shiny bling brigade, Brewtus is a good value, well performing and adaptable option - much like FC's gear......largely underestimated in terms of performance and ROI. Personally, I have a fair bit gear and often buy stuff because of interest or curiosity. My kitchen bench at home has a KVW and a Minore IV and my roastery bench has a GS3 and another Minore IV, along with numerous new Mazzer, Compak, Macap and NS grinders. What gear do you think gets the most use ? What machine do I prefer to use ? Hands down it's the humble and former star from 6 years ago......Brewtus...... and here's why. I have to be at the warehouse very early in the morning to start roasting but I need a cuppa with my breakfast otherwise I don't tend to function properly. I don't have time at 5am in the morning to wait for "dream machines" to heat up, yet coffee for me is a ritual experience.........one that requires the ultimate skill and precision. I am also extremely fussy - stuff has to work and work well, always. I will sink shots that others happily consume.....because I'm always testing, testing, testing. When I wake up, I can switch on the Minore and by the time I've had a shower and sitting down to my brekkie, the Minore is ready to pull a shot and steam milk - that's 15 minutes. Of course, I might help the group and portafilter along a bit by running water from the machine to heat everything up to prevent soak, but it's fast........extremely fast. Once I hit the roastery, there is no time to make coffee for another 6 hours and if I need to grab a quickie whilst roasting, then I also goto the Minore as the GS3 is in my opinion just an over-hyped and over-priced machine that is very temperamental and takes ages to reach temp, even on FULL heating. Why I also prefer to use the Minores at home and work is because I can't stand how ridiculously variable the KVW and GS3 are at producing a quick 1-cup coffee - that is, the simple walk-up test......turn on, wait for a short time and then pull a shot.......they are terrible at the walk-up coffee because they tend to take a bit to get stable and consistent whereas the Minore is more forgiving. As to the cup.......fortunately, I have 35 years of Espresso making, hence I can make an equally good cup on the Minore as I can on the home and factory dream machines. I'm sure FC does the same on his home gear as well because it's the operator not the machine. The difference is negligible or nothing to get wound up over as there are plenty of other things for that !. yes, with enough shots I achieve holy grail on the dream team, but it takes a lot more time and a hell of a lot more wasted coffee shots to dial in the tolerances - both things the average coffee lover would be frustrated at. I'm not promoting the Minore.......it's just an example of a machine that's not in the "top 5" these days yet it can, in the right hands, with the right beans, produce heaven. These days time is more and more important to me.....so I won't be buying any more "fan-boy" machines because they are just pretty much the same. Good luck on your search Moony.
  • Shortlist Update 1. Bezzera Strega 2. Rocket Evoluzione Giotto V2 3. Profitec Pro 500 4. Rocket Appartamento From the above, may I suggest that I'd go the lever machine/ Game changers 1. e61 HX machines take 45 mins to heat up. I think its already been written but what the hell I'll do it again...this is an internet furphy (ok getting down to it so there is no further confusion...read BS) 2. Tasting all these Coffees in Cafes that use La Marzoccos and the like .. + huge Mazzer Grinders with their experienced Baristas rarely produce a latte that rates better than a 9.2/10 imho .. and that's the better Coffees. Even with my cheap lever - PV Lusso .. in its heyday could produce better Coffee according to my taste buds with scores of 9.2 9.3 9.4 For some reason .. in the last 6-12 months .. I hadn't bean able to get a Coffee up past a 9.2/10 .. but that was still very good. Although I admit that I don't have an educated palate .. Coffees from one of these e61 Machines all seem to produce a 1 layered flavour (occasionally 2) with better body than what I can produce on my small lever machine. It is like the extraction of flavour is all at one speed that is abundant with one particular flavour that the beans are offering .. whereas a lever extracts the flavours at different speeds and temperature which captures more of the range on offer .. therefore producing a shot with more layers. I have never tasted the exotic flavours that my lever machine was able to extract .. in a Cafe made Coffee... umm .. maybe once I did .. and that was quite a pleasant surprise at the time. The Cafe produced Coffee does have a rich tan/chocolatey colour which does look impressive in the cup. I could never produce this on my lever ... but then .. appearance does count .. but nowhere near as much as taste.  :coffee2: Mate please.... can I suggest that a nice simple approach is required. It matters not what brand equipment the coffee is made on. For most consumers (being anyone that drinks coffee for enjoyment/pleasure) it is either "great", "acceptable", or "crap". This is the responsibility of the person managing and running the equipment. The rest including scores and layers is all in the mind ( and possibly but not necessarily, on the palate) of the individual beholder...  Copper boiler - from further reading .. there are claims that the copper in the boiler (and therefore tubes) acts as a microbial inhibitor .. which makes sense .. as Copper is used on plants/fruit trees to kill mould and fungal infestations. Sounds like a good thing to me. The copper Vs tinned copper Vs stainless steel thing is both a technical as well as a political (country based) discussion and nothing to do with microbial inhibition however if you like the idea there is nothing wrong with that. All the best, Attilio, one of only 2 sponsors I know of that regularly help participants with advice or special offers directly in this forum.
  • on 1477034287:
    Shortlist Update 1. Bezzera Strega 2. Rocket Evoluzione Giotto V2 3. Profitec Pro 500 4. Rocket Appartamento From the above, may I suggest that I'd go the lever machine/
    It was a miraculous rise to the top of my list. On the money eh? M -  e61 HX machines take 45 mins to heat up. FC - I think its already been written but what the hell I'll do it again...this is an internet furphy (ok getting down to it so there is no further confusion...read BS) Educate us ... how long do they take? I wouldn't know .. I never owned one .. but if it is true .. I'd never want to Even 30 mins moping about without functioning Brain is a big ask. M - Tasting all these Coffees in Cafes that use La Marzoccos and the like .. + huge Mazzer Grinders with their experienced Baristas rarely produce a latte that rates better than a 9.2/10 imho .. and that's the better Coffees.
    on 1477034287:
    FC - Mate please.... can I suggest that a nice simple approach is required. it is either "great", "acceptable", or "crap". This is the responsibility of the person managing and running the equipment. The rest including scores and layers is all in the mind ( and possibly but not necessarily, on the palate) of the individual beholder...
    M - Sounds like you missed my ratings thread where I tried different beans and gave them a score. The whole concept started because when I'd go to a Cafe with someone .. I'd ask how was the Coffee .. they's say 'Great' 'nice' 'ok' .. which would always leave me unsatisfied with their response ... How great?  .. just Great .. what the hell is that? Give me a more accurate assessment .. by rating it out of 10 .. and they said an 8 .. I'd think .. ok it was nice ... a 9/10 would be a really nice one. 10/10 and it would tell me it was up there with the best Coffee they'd ever had. Only a score will give you an idea whether to bring them back to that Cafe for another one. FC - "great", "acceptable", or "crap" ^ That sort of response I'd expect from your average Nescafe Instant drinker. It doesn't cut the mustard in a Coffee forum. We are more particular than that. Did it have Melon and blackcurrent undertones with a hint of Passionfruit?  :rofl
    on 1477034287:
    ..... however if you like the idea there is nothing wrong with that
    Maaate .... A $1500 Coffee Machine with make a 'Great' coffee ... and here I am willing to pay $3,000 for one that will also make 'Great' Coffee Will it make a Coffee twice as nice .. Nope ... so where's the sense in that? ... yet that is exactly what I am going to do. Go figure. And if I were to follow ol' mate Bretts tip ... I'd turf my $520 Compak Grinder .. cause I need to pay $1,200 for a Super duper Grinder to make my Coffee taste 'Great'
    on 1477034287:
    Attilio, one of only 2 sponsors I know of that regularly help participants with advice or special offers directly in this forum.
    You probably know this already .. but I'll write it up just for added emphasis * Nice Guys don't get the Girls * Nice Guys finish last * Nice Guys don't get to make the babies .. but they do get to change their nappies  :mad:
    Hey mycuppa .. was hoping you would pop by and weigh in on which Coffee machine I'm a bit spent on ol' mate FC ... so I'll get back. Must be time for a Coffee break .... oh damn .. no Coffee Machine .. drats  :'(
    ps. And for the record - when purchasing a Coffee Machine or any other Coffee item .. I always check first if forum sponsors have what I'm after before looking elsewhere
  • on 1477040445:
    ps.... for the record - when purchasing a Coffee Machine or any other Coffee item .. I always check first if forum sponsors have what I'm after before looking elsewhere
    Hi Moon, trouble is you actually dont know what you are after, have come in with total BS information to try and pick between individual machines in your short list, and have now had a go at the only site sponsor that has offered any technical help/advice. All the best in yopur search, Attilio
  • Message to forum mods If any part or posts of mine have been offensive and crossed the line .. please feel free to delete them I have decided that the Bezzera Strega is the Coffee Machine that I want. Went the long route .. only got there in the end .. which is good. Thanks to everyone who has assisted me in this journey ..  :thumb: Koffee Kosmo Brett deegee Fresh Coffee mycuppa
  • Moon, I think you should look back through the posts on this thread and decide which elements are appropriate and which should be removed. You mentioned nappies before. I don't particularly feel like cleaning up more sh!t than I'm already forced to.
  • Wow, I take the kids for a Farm Stay and you guys fill up the forum.  I have learned two things from this and other threads discussing the immediate and impending bench-bling headed for Mr Moon: 1: fresh coffee is so sure that his machines are par-excellence he was prepared t ship one to Mr Moon to try for a week.  Seriously, what a great guy. 2: Mr Moon like most of us, knew what he wanted all along but was not going to drop $2950 on a Strega without experiencing the thrill of the chase. Now, time for everybody in forum land to learn that Mr Brett is very tired and just wants a quiet life.  Mr Moon, enjoy your new toy and the enjoy the free advice! ENJOY IT.........!
  • My apologies, I was tired and I should never have printed that price. *Edited! And... edit to this post: Moony, I've re-read your post and I agree with Kelsey.  Go back and clean them up yourself please!  Moreover, I think you owe Fresh Coffee an apology!  He is the only machine seller around these parts brave enough to give advice and that he would back it financially too....!!!! AND, as a retiree you've got to imagine he's personally not making a red-cent.  Just pride and generously  'giving back' doing the talking.  Think about that little chestnut for just a moment.... 5,4,3,2,  :doh:
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