TGCI barista training

conan

I was just wondering how "the Industry" feels about The Gourmet Coffee Institute training. I am currently thinking about undergoing courses with them and wonder whether the certificates are worth the paper they are printed on.??

Any help would be muchly appreciated!

over_extracted

the only knowlege that you will get from such course are very basic ones and do not equal what you can learn by being tought by a well experienced barista during service time in a cafe.Its good to take the time and get some experience at a well known cafe.good luck OE .PS just dont get riped off by sharks out there..

Reschsmooth

What's gourmet coffee? Is it endorsed by Quentin Tarantino?

FreshCoffee2

Hi Conan, taking your question completely on face value. No they are not worth the paper they are written on UNLESS they happen to be accredited by whoever is the accrediting body for "baristaship" in Australia. You see, if you do an "accredited" course, then it should have a section, or continuing sections, whereby you need to have completed so many hours of real work behind a machine in order for you to eventually pass the unit of study. This includes having your trainer passing you in each section done...kind of like doing a mini apprenticeship. For this to happen you also need accredited trainers. This is not to say that some non accredited trainers are any worse at this job, or know any less than those that are accredited.  I am sure there are some very good non accredited trainers, just as I am sure there will  be accredited charlatans out there. If on the other hand you do a course, no matter who it is with, that has no way of marking or adjudicating you on the work, or does not require so many hours real work behind a machine, then I dont think you can expect any resultant piece of paper to be worth much to you. These are very much "for your own information" courses, and that is not to say that they dont contain the right informationm, just they are not accredited in terms of some kind of "qualification". Taking such a course is still a good idea. You have to start somewhere, and no matter whether you have a) absolutely no knowledge at all or b) you are already working behiond a machine but have never had any formal training, these kinds of courses done on an ad hoc basis can only improve what you dont, or already do, or should know. Goodluck, FC.

john

Conan Out of curiosity, do you have any experience with espresso equipment??? If so, how much!!!! JD

admin

Hi there - I don't want this to be the final word on TGCI, but just to let you know, last year we did a review of some of the prominent barista training schools in Sydney and Melbourne. This is an industry that seems to have its fair share of shonky operators, but TGCI were one of the first to offer a comprehensive range of courses and we were impressed with their commitment to providing a real 'industry' introduction to the job. Also I understand they now have a programme where they try to offer 'on the job' experience with a number of cafes. I don't want to comment on specifics (eg. value for money) or make comparisons with other schools, but if you're a beginner in Sydney and seriously looking to get an industry job, I believe they're certainly worth considering. Admin

admin

Re-raised for reference (see post in have your say -A

ryan

just to put a spanner in the works re training my best friend did one of the TOBYS  coffee courses in sydney $150.00         he said it was great .  all good right. Anyway he came back to the coffee shop he worked as a barista with a few new tricks.    ie cleaning more,  adjust machine pump pressure up to 9.   it was at 7.  etc. and tamp a lot harder.  no more old coffee left in the hopper,    the cafe used to grind it all in the morning so it wouldnt grind during the day to annoy everyone.  a few times during the quiet periods but never during busy times....the boss would yell out,    "shut that machine up" Barista now ordered coffee in weekly, insist it was fresh roasted.    and the coffee was a lot nicer, fresher,  more compliments,  and he thought he was a better barista. PROBLEM.       the boss of the CAFE was pissed off,  he was taking too long now on the machine making coffee,   the grinder was giving everyone the shits going all the time,     the delivery weekly and more often annoyed him,   he was making no more money,   and his barista was now obsessed with making perfect coffee for what seemed to him,   no difference in money in his pocket. plus his barista seemed obsessed with a clean machine. he made a point of telling my  friend no more staff would do coffee courses as everything was fine before, and he doesnt have time for all that coffee obsesive stuff.  he wants bums on seats. he said he didnt need kids adjusting his machine.    and customers dont care what they get so long as his hot and got froth on it. my friend said this was mentioned to him by the other staff also,    ie boss was complaining behind his back that he had become a coffee geek. anyway thats just another opinion on how coffee courses can affect people. my friend is leaving this company now and going to a bigger place in the city where hopefully his skills are appreciated. but its the bosses cafe/  etc so my friend understands his point of view also .   he said the boss was italian and drank espresso but wasnt too fussed with his coffee and so couldnt understand why beans had to be so fresh etc. cheers

admin

It's very disappointing to hear stories like this, especially when enthusiastic staff are trying to raise standards. One thing I'd like to suggest is that you name the cafe - I believe that the more good cafes get the credit they deserve and slack ones get the bad publicity they deserve, the more everyone will be encouraged to lift their game - comments? -A

sharkboy

I can't understand why cafes don't see coffee in a similar way to other food items. If they sell sandwiches I hope they don't use bread that is a week old and has been stored badly. Might as well make the sandwich on a dirty counter top with wilted salad and hack it in two with a blunt knife... I'm not great with analogies but I hope you get what mean. -Stephen-

ryan

wont name the cafe. large place          south yarra melbourne.   very very busy, and very profitable. my pal may get punched in the nose if I name it.   not worried about legal,   more the punch. telling stories out of work quickly get back to the boss.         and as i say,   its his cafe/restuarant.  and what do we know,   its always busy. the coffee doser is full to the brim by opening now.  No  noisy grinders in this cafe. i guess re sandwhich analogy///   you cant see bad coffee.  only taste it,     and some people dont notice with sugar etc. cheers

FreshCoffee2

I have absolutely no argument with 99% of what you have told us and agree entirely except for just one thing....the adjustment of water pressure is something that should not be being done by the operator. In this case the operator is most probably working on a specification he has been told about in the coffee class. You need to be able to enterpret book specifications according to the type of equipment, the type of coffee, and the individual conditions. This takes experience, and there are two possible scenarios here: a) It is probable the adjustment of water pressure did nothing for the brew that could be discerned...particularly as other variables were changed at the same time (eg using more freshly ground coffee). In any case who says the guage is accurate in the first place? and b) an espresso machine operator is not an espresso machine serviceman with the requisite expertise & qualifications(which is expertise gained in another field to that required for making the coffee). Unqualified hands fiddling around inside espresso machines can result in electrocution and burning, let alone the making of adjustments where none may be required. If I were the cafe owner I would also be raising eyebrows at someone touching my equipment without first asking, and doing it without the proper expertise, and placing me (the theoretical cafe owner) in the possible position of getting me gaoled for industrial manslaughter in the event of this employee electrocuting himself while conducting unauthorised service works on something he is not qualified to touch, on the basis of a 4 hour espresso lesson. The above is simply mentioned to place a real life perspective on the subject. Regardz, FC.

ryan

Agreed FC just a note, my friend was taught, and would have anyway, to have power off.  We have discussed this previously and my friend and I all agree power under the hood off machines is an area people seem to forget about. the Owner of the cafe/restuarant gave permission, and was done in operators (my friend) own time after closing. Machine hadnt been serviced for over 2 years, including water filter which my friend also changed. After cleaning slime and cobwebs off.  The owner forgot that it even had a water filter.  (hidden under counter) my friend did all this knowing he was leaving, but wanted to clean it all up, and felt the filthy filter etc were just plain good manners and decency. the machine was paid off years ago so the owner wishes to spend nothing on it seeing as it works fine. He thinks the coffee is a lot better re fresh coffee/ water pressure etc but take the point that its just his opinion. anyway its back to old pre ground coffee when he leaves as the grinder now has a sticker on it saying grind before work. cheers ryan