Advice required please

Comments

• FreshCoffee2

  October 2015

  Hi and welcome. First I need to declare that i know absolutely nothing about your Delonghi coffee machine. However, I feel eminently qualified to give you the folllowing advice. 50 degrees is TOTALLY UNACCEPTABLE. Having noted that however it is necessary to mention that unless this has been measured in some kind of standard way with a thermometer of known calibration - and NOT with a milk thermometer because these can be totally inaccurate -  then the figure you have given may not be entirely accurate. Note also that many individuals differ in their opinions of what constitutes tepid or hot. Not trying to be unhelpful, just being honest. So it is necessary to have an accurate temperature reading.  OK : Many manufacturers importers have a telephone number for customer advice. Take a good look around your machine and see if there is a sticker with such a number. If there is, call them. If your machine only has an automatic milk frother, the above advice is critical, because they will be able to explain if there is a way of managing the output milk temperature (or....read the owner booklet). If the machine has the option of using a steam pipe to froth (texture) milk in the traditional way, my advice would be to forget the auto frother and only use the steam pipe to froth milk. The longer you froth the milk using a steam pipe, the hotter it wll get, and if you go too far / too long it will scald/burn/boil the milk. If the machine ONLY has an auto frother, and the delonghi agents advise you there is no way of regulating output milk temperature on your model, then I would venture to advise that you should return the machine as being not fit for purpose, and look for something else that will produce milk coffee at the required temperature. As a guide, under normal conditions on the east coast of Australia, the right temperature range for textured (frothed) milk to add to your espresso coffee base to make capp/latte etc., is between 65 and 75 degrees centigrade, where 65 degrees is considered luke warm, and anything above 75 will burn the milk and destroy creaminess and nudging 80 will burn your mouth. This is the way its done in traditional coffee making. Automatic machines have in the past, been well known for producing "tepid" (black) coffee and frothed millk, however the better brands have put a lot of work into fixing that in recent years. This means, there are autos out there that produce milk coffee at a much more acceptable temperature, and as a general rule I would be inclined to spend more rather than less on higher end models.  I would say...stay away from cheap end automatics. Hope that helps.

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• mycuppa

  October 2015

  Hello, Further to FC's post, it is most likely that something is not operating correctly with the milk frothing capability. Many systems that take fresh milk - either chilled or at room temperature - from a reservoir and attempt to "stretch" into the heated froth in the process of a flowing output rarely hit the temperature mark during a short timeframe. I don't know the machine you have bought - but I have plenty of experience with other similar types of automatic solutions right up to the commercial systems used in large offices costing $15K and putting out 200 coffees per day. What you see a barista do with hi-powered dry steam from a large boiler that can take a minute or 2, these autos try to achieve in a few seconds. The very first step is to separate the espresso (black) from the milk. Coolish milk will make a latte something like what you are describing. If you are getting crema of a golden brown color it generally means your temp will be somewhere in the ballpark of OK. 2nd step is to check the owners manual to see if there is a "What to do when things go wrong" troubleshooting section in the rear of the manual, e.g. If the frothed milk is cool, then check XYZ......... Once you have qualified that the problem is either coffee or milk and there is nothing on the machine settings that may be wrong, then as per FC's advice contact the manufacturer's support centre. It will also save you the frustration of the support centre person asking you to check these things before calling back to take the next possible solution step. Like all things, temperature is relative - people have different thinking - what might be OK for someone is cold for another. It's probable that the milk might be running too fast through the "instant" frother and is only getting air bubbles added to it without really heating up or at best it's only half heating because it's not in contact with the heat source long enough. Look for a restrictive knob somewhere that allows you to slow down the flow of milk. The automated milk from many Autos will never be hot (certainly not saying that applies to your case) - it's because hot enough for most people will result in additional buildup of the scum residues that occur when the flow stops - it sticks like glue on parts that cannot be easily seen and eventually clogs the system. Good luck.  

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• FreshCoffee2

  October 2015

  What a team  :thumb: Oh yeah I forgot to mention.....hope you are pre warming your cups. Failure to do so will suck an aweful lot of heat out of the brew, and could make what started as an acceptable temperature (albeit possibly at the lower end of the "acceptable" range), become unacceptable.

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• welovelattes

  October 2015

  Hi and many thanks for taking the time to reply. I did not fully elaborate in my original request as our saga with Delonghi has been rather protracted. However, yes we do warm our cups each time. We have contacted Delonghi 5 times and they have advised "Italians like their milk coffee at lower temperatures than Australians" as well as sending out 3 different parts which we were unable to add to the machine. They also, after the 3rd call, said we had one with a" faulty gasket" and replaced the whole unit - naturally the replacement unit also only heated to 50 degrees. So the they had us return the machine to their contracted service providers who found nothing wrong with the machine. We then called the service contractor yesterday who said there is no way the automatic milk frother will ever reach above the 50 degree level and suggested we manually froth the milk. My thinking therefore is why have a so called automatic machine. We also contacted the Dept of Fair Trading and they agree that the machine is not fulfilling the obligation so we are at the stage where we will return it to Bing Lee and obtain a refund. As such, we would truly appreciate some suggestions as to which machines we should be looking at. Typically we have 2 or 3 coffees per day each (just the 2 of us), we like large lattes extra hot and extra strong and feel now a manual machine is the way forward, especially after this debacle.  Many thanks

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• mycuppa

  October 2015

  I think you have answered your own question, e.g. only a manual system will give you that sort of control. Autos, like pod and capsule systems, are intended for convenience - quick and simple without requiring much effort on the part of the person preparing the beverage, nor much in the way of cleaning up afterwards. Most these systems will never dose enough to satisfy the extra strong brigade and none that I have seen (sub $10K) will texture the milk hot enough for the extra hot devotees...speed compromises the quality - there is a law of science involved here. Autos prepare a relatively quick, small, drinkable beverage that may at times be superior to instant, a vending machine using powdered consumables and some of those low-end $199 manual machines used with pre-ground coffee........but that's about it I'm afraid. 80% of the $$ you spend on the cost of an auto are for the convenience factor......not flexibility to allow you to customize the cup.

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• Brett H

  October 2015

  Wow... What a team!  Welcome Welovelattes... It looks like it's time for a new "what machine/s would suit my situation" thread.  Clearly we have the industry's leading expertise with us and they're not afraid to share their extraordinary experience!  :thumb:

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• welovelattes

  October 2015

  We are indebted to all that have replied.  It has been frustrating with the Delonghi as we spent $,1520 and would have assumed a reasonable coffee would not be out of the question. I must admit I was dubious about an automatic machine and my fears have been realised. Will pen a letter to Bing Lee and see what happens tomorrow. If it is resolved to our satisfaction (that is - we obtain a refund) I will be back to ask for professional advice regarding a new machine. Have a great weekend

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• GeekKopi

  October 2015

  Welcome Welovelattes. Sorry to hear about your bad experience with your current machine. Mycuppa and freshcoffee have provided you with amazing info - great knowledge between them two. Let us know how you go with Bing Lee and then we can chat about a new machine.

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