Ponte Vecchio Lusso - advice please?

Moon · October 2013

Hi

I'm considering purchasing a Ponte Vecchio Lusso 1 group from Italy, and have been reading threads here and elsewhere about this machine. I'm wondering what advice both current and previous owners of this Lever have after owning one?

- It appears the batch that Jack at Sorrentina imported had issues with the group which was diagnosed as faulty seals, yet from what I have read .. there has also been a problem with scoring of the piston .. which may have been the cause of the leaking from the group rather than faulty seals? I'm wondering whether the leaking has been fixed by changing the seals .. or whether after a short time the problem has returned .. which would suggest that either there is/was a manufacturing fault with the machining of the pistons or possibly the piston shaft is scoring the surface when the lever is being used?
As owners would have probably already changed seals .. has the surface been checked for scratches?

I'm trying to find out how prevalent the problem of leaking groups is .. and what owners have done to rectify this?
It has been suggested that if the scoring is only superficial, that a 'honing' attachment for a power drill (from Repco) can be used to polish the surface of the piston. Another suggestion was to get the piston chromed. Is this a good idea or would this cause a problem with the lever shaft fitting?

Are people generally happy with their PV Lusso regardless of their flaws? I'm wondering whether I should take the risk on getting one .. or save up and get a better lever machine like the Strega or Achilles. Even after laying out the extra $ for a better quality machine doesn't guarantee it won't have a niggle or two of its own. From what I've been reading, the Achilles has a few flaws of its own in the design department?

Another suggestion for the Lusso is to use a varnish, say Estapol? on the inside of the cover to guard the metal against rust .. being in a hot .. possibly humid environment?
I'm also thinking about insulating the boiler with something like 'Insulbrite' to guard the plastic on the electric cables attached (or in close proximity) to the boiler from melting?

I would appreciate any advice on this.. even comments like - 'forget it ::) .. the sooner you aim higher, the better off you'll be.. as in, I had one once and glad I have upgraded to something better.

Cheers :thumb:

Brett H · October 2013

Hi Moon and welcome. I've only seen this machine a couple of times but what put me off was the volume of the baskets and the volume of espresso being less than a machine with a commercial group like the Strega. If I were buying id be saving for the Strega but you know the best advice is to try one... Or many out!

Moon · October 2013

Thanks Brett Yeah .. I'd love a Strega, only coming from A Gaggia Baby, I thought I was leapfrogging over my previous ideal, which was a Silvia .. to the Lusso. It would feel like skipping the assistant role and going straight to head coach if I was to get a Strega. Some like jumping in the deep end .. although it's financially better to avoid Upgraditis in steps and go for gold. Wonder how Lacehim feels about his old Lusso now that he has a Strega? I should mention. I drink latte (use 50ml) and rarely drink shots .. although, with a better machine I may develop a taste for them?

UNM · October 2013

I am perfectly happy with my classic Arrarex Caravel. Price is lower than a PV lusso. It does have idiosyncracies of its own and is not for everyone though. Just thought I'd mention it.

mycuppa · October 2013

on 1382227758:

I should mention. I drink latte and rarely drink shots .. although, with a better machine I may develop a taste for them?

If you prefer milk-based espresso, then a non-lever machine may be suitable - not suggesting one system is superior to the other. You should really try and play with a lever before you commit as it may not be to your liking - a few people I know discovered this point themselves.

Moon · October 2013

The idea of a lever machine appeals to me in that.. * I'm male, so I shouldn't have a problem pulling the lever against the spring, or height. * Additional process in making my coffee rather than simply pressing a button. * Simplicity of design with less parts to falter. * Ease of maintenance procedures rather than having to send it off. Open it up and take a look? * Small yet stable on the kitchen bench. * Parts seem cheaper compared to other brands. * n00b friendly and temperature stable * Lusso - Best bang for buck in its price range Dislikes.. * No authorized repairers in Oz in case of warranty issues that may arise. * Lack of quality control by the manufacturer .. relatively new machines have had leaking group issues. (Likelihood of these new machines leaking through the group is a bit of a worry .. not uncommon) * Cheaper build - I understand that a better manufactured machine would cost significantly more. * Ok .. small shot .. have to get used to the Fellini move .. no drama there.. milk drinks anyway. * Relieving false pressure - no big deal there either. Earlier considerations: La Pavoni Professional and Electra MCAL

mycuppa · October 2013

Moon - this is not about you, but the whole equipment dilemma that dominates coffee forums at infinite. Coffee should be about enjoying a memorable cup and not having to worry about anything other than if you have your machine at the right temperature to match the bean/blend, your machine is clean, your grinder set correctly, your dose perfect and whether you are using the beans in the correct date period. Trust me, getting the grinder and dose to match the actual coffee in the hopper is beyond the vast majority of coffee machine users. Even skilled and experienced cafe baristas pulling 400 cups a day struggle with this on a day to day basis. It is never as simple as pressing a button - except if you have a capsule or pod machine. Honestly, if people spend so much time worrying about the risks and consequences of failures and going through all sorts of gymnastic routines every time they prepare a coffee..........my goodness that would take the fun out of coffee - or does it make the whole ritual kinda special ?.

Moon · October 2013

I agree that the aim is to end up with and enjoy a really nice cup of coffee, or to use another example - reach the summit of Everest, but to others, like me, its not only about the end result in the cup, but enjoying the process of how you achieved it. I'm certainly not anal about being able to pour a 'God shot' like some.. and good luck to them, heck, I like cola in my scotch and have milk in my coffee.. or is that coffee in my milk? :P I enjoy the coffee I'm making now from my Gaggia Baby .. and after beginning my journey with a hand me down el cheapo $80 krups, I have always enjoyed each stage of the learning process. After a year I upgraded to a $200 Sunbeam and thought the coffee I made from that was great .. I can now confidently say that I will enjoy the next upgrade immensely. Looking back at what I thought was nice coffee back then is hilarious these days :D .. yet I am still only a few rungs up the ladder. I never imagined I'd be roasting my own beans .. even if it's only in a basic popper. No going back. It's funny .. According to my tastebuds, I can make a better coffee from my $500 Gaggia with its $160 Delonghi grinder on its finest setting than many of the coffee shops that use $8.000 espresso machines using their commercial Mazzer Majors. A lot of that is probably due to the beans they're using and the volume of the shot? The key at home is experimenting until we achieve exactly what we want. These forums have been a huge help to me .. although I realize that the coffee purists are often discussing how to achieve their ultimate God shot .. which is not what I am after. Some think I'm a bit of a perfectionist .. and to a certain extent they are right. I'm an 8/10 Guy .. which means that I enable myself happiness and enjoyment with what I am able to achieve .. and not left frustrated because I've fallen short of perfection. For me .. it's a nice place to be, as it allows me to enjoy the journey. This is it for me * Looks good * Solid * Reliable * Good value * Makes great coffee (well, plays its role and doesn't let the team down)

mycuppa · October 2013

What ever direction you take Moon, please do not under-estimate the importance of being able to adjust group temp. Coffees respond to a broad range of temperatures based upon the bean type, roast profile and bean age. Having the ability to fix extraction issues by temp gives you a whole lot more power than grind and dose alone. Adjusting temp up and down is like a super magic wand that fixes so many challenges in the cup and can completely transform the coffee.

Moon · October 2013

Thanks for taking an interest and replying .. hope I don't sound too rigid .. so much still to learn. Apparently the pstat is set at 1.6 Bar default and will have to drop it down to 1.1 according to what I've been reading. I was thinking of asking Ponte Vecchio to adjust it when leaving the factory (and mark it) otherwise I'll do it when it arrives. Been over on HB reading up on the PV's brain fade and lobotomy fix .. and keeping an eye out for whatever else goes wrong. This one is a heat issue from being too close to the boiler. Insulating the boiler is a must by the looks. I intend getting one of those stick on temperature stickers for the group so that I can observe where the sweet spot is to pull the shot. All these tips from the forums .. great stuff. To keep my options open What other single boiler machine do members here recommend? The Lusso 1 group can be imported from Italy for AU$936 + $170 shipping = $1,106 Being under $1,000 means no GST, import duty and declaration charges. I'd be willing to say, go up to $1,500 for a local machine? Ok .. you can say 'for an additional $300 you can get this beauty for $1,800' :'(

Lacehim · October 2013

Hi Moon, I had a 2 group lusso from Jack at Sorrentia. Paid $1500 for it, he only stocks the 2 group in red. As you know I sold mine, mainly because I got a little fed up with PV, the manufacturer. They have a quality machine that can pull amazing shots, steam milk like a dream, small in size! BUT some of the components just weren't up to scratch. That said I also got what I paid for, but I would have been happy to pay a bit more and no have all these niggles. Shots are around the 40ml with a double basket and a felini. My commercial lever that I just sold does the same volume with a standard pull but you need a blood strong arm to pull the lever down. The lusso was a breeze in comparison. The lusso's small baskets are actually very forgiving and you do get a quality shot. Steaming milk was also amazingly easy. Best machine I ever had actually for consistent quality milk. You can fit an antivac (there's a thread on here where I did mine) that removes the pain of bleeding off the false pressure. What went wrong with mine? Well I had group problems/seal issues. I got really good at changing the seals, down to 15 minutes in the end! lol. One group actually scratched inside and dripped, then wouldn't seal. I replaced the seal (best done with Jacks PV tool) and it didn't work, and in the end Jack got me a replacement from PV. Well actually he ended up giving me one of his because PV took 2 months to send the group for a single machine that doesn't fit my machine. That was pretty much the final straw for me with the machine. Great machine, looks great, but even though Jack made a massive effort for me to get things sorted out it just appeared to me that PV didn't really give two hoots about me as an end customer. I don't know what sort of warranty you get from Italy, but I would buy from Jack at Sorrentina again in a heart beat, he's great to deal with. If you buy direct from Italy, I can pretty much guarantee that you will suffer some issue and I hope you can speak good Italian to get it fixed.

You are getting advice some someone that just sold his Quick Mill Achilles commercial lever though. Some might as mad, but I'm going to explore manual brewing for a bit instead of having $3k's worth of bling on the counter. To finish, it is a great machine, will make great coffee, but if your not handy with repairing or pulling apart a machine to fix it, it will cost $$$ and you'll just end up frustrated. Personally I would keep saving, and buy a decent lever first time. What you have to remember is that if you buy a good expensive machine it will be worth quite a bit of money when you go to sell it, but buy cheap and it will be worth nothing. It's why I will never buy a Sunbeam or a Breville espresso machine! Lots of happy PV owners out there though, and I haven't heard of any issues from the new owner of mine. I did my best to get it up to scratch though before it went. Good luck. If you have any specific questions just let me know.

Moon · October 2013

Hi Lacehim Thanks for the reply. I've been reading your posts/threads here and around the traps and it certainly helps with you having had a Lusso. Hmm .. I thought you upgraded to a Strega .. not an Achillies? I'm sure I read about you having the Strega but didn't like the pump in it? Anyway, I was interested in what you thought of the Lusso looking back on it after now having upgraded to the Strega, Achilles, Londinium class machines? You moved on the upgrade .. manual brewing now eh .. what's that? Turkish powder in a pot on the stove? :D I was in contact with Jack a bit of late .. only he is flat out shifting house and said he wants to settle in his new place first. Apparently Jack also has trouble speaking Italian to Ponte Vecchio. Although I'd much rather deal with Jack .. it would take a while and then some .. so I started searching for retailers in Italy. Found one and just managed a pass with the communication.. we tried English. They didn't have a 1 group in stock and the PV factory was fresh out .. meaning I have to wait 6 weeks (end Nov). I am also looking at the new Macap M2D Programmable stepped grinder.. that is not available here yet. Although the PV Lusso can make good coffee .. the idea of taking the plunge on a new machine prone to faults is a turn off. So what I really wanted to hear from you .. having been there done that .. is your advice saying get one, they're worth it .... or save up for a better machine .. which is what you said --->much appreciated. Heaps more helpful than .. one of those .. 'it's up to you' replies :pan Warranty is also an issue for me .. especially with all the problems the Lusso has had. I guess at least if the group leaks .. Jack may still have the spare one they sent for you? .. lol. Cheers

mycuppa · October 2013

on 1382247113:

I don't know what sort of warranty you get from Italy, but I would buy from Jack at Sorrentina again in a heart beat, he's great to deal with. If you buy direct from Italy, I can pretty much guarantee that you will suffer some issue and I hope you can speak good Italian to get it fixed.

Not having had any direct experience with this specific Italian company, but having dealt with quite a few European coffee suppliers in the last 28 years, I would say frustrating is just being VERY polite. The customer culture is not the same as in Australia - in my opinion no amount of emails, phone calls, good-guy/bad-guy routines, yell and scream, calm and polite, simple, detailed or brief, etc. seem to get any successful traction - sometimes the simplest request can take agonizing effort and time. Even grabbing the attention of the company owners can get you nowhere - just spinning your wheels. based on L's well put post, there is some very wise advice contained within........my take on it is you really should have open discussion with the Australian importer as some equipment manufacturers barely support their agents adequately, let alone the general public. I had the same discussion with a customer about this particular topic just a couple of months ago and he went ahead as he planned to self-import - it has turned into a code-brown situation with a beautiful and expensive machine adorning his kitchen bench......still unable make it's first cup of coffee 9 weeks after arriving.

Moon · October 2013

Oh Man .. what a shocker. I can remember a poster on one of the forums saying .. with every coffee machine I've had .. I've needed after sales service. Coffee machines do seem like one of those items that can easily develop a problem .. and unless you are Mr Gadget .. you're stuffed without a warranty from a seller with some clout .. or should I say persuasive skills with manufacturers? Perhaps I should check on the Retailers Italian before purchasing? The idea of going simple design with not a lot of parts that can go wrong is false economy if it's an unreliable machine where what little is in or on the machine falls apart, blows up, or melts. :doh:

Koffee_Kosmo · October 2013

There are other small lever machines about from the so called atomic era However it depends on how many coffees you want to make in a single session If it's 2 doubles in succession then I hope Crema Gulumay will come into this conversation and explain why he has a $6k Izzo lever machine on the bench and mostly uses his 1950s Caravel lever KK

Lacehim · October 2013

I do know of someone who has a Olympic Cremina 67 for sale in Brisbane. Lovely machine, a lever but the manual type (no spring) and has steam capability. Let me know if you want his number.

Moon · October 2013

Thanks for that Lacehim .. yeah, a Cremina would be nice. 8) It appears it's on eBay atm .. starting price $1,455 with a BIN price of $1,885. It's a bit out of my range, especially seeing I want to also upgrade to a good grinder to go with my new coffee machine. Having doubts about the Ponte Vecchio Lusso's reliability? Seems the Strega would be the go with the Levers, although I have taken another look at the Electra MCAL which also stretches the budget. Turned away from the levers and considering a Bezzera Unica PID e61 group machine after reading up, and comparing it to an Isomac Zaffiro. Both single boilers .. Bez 500ml .. Zaf 800ml .. the Bez heats up to steam temp in about 30 secs whereas the Zaf takes approx 2 mins which was criticized by the reviewers.. even though it scored highly in other respects. Seeing it would be rare that I'd be making more than 1 or 2 milk drinks at a time (mostly 1) .. the 500ml boiler would suit my requirements .. and has a switch to turn the pump on for more water to be transferred from the tank into the boiler. Reviews on this particular Bezzera model are scarce .. so any info/thoughts are appreciated. The grinder I am considering is the Macap M2M/M2D

Lacehim · October 2013

No offence but it doesn't sound like you know what you want. I think you need to test drive a few machines first. Where do you live? Levers and pump machines are different in terms of the effort you have to put into making the espresso, and taste is different also. One persons perfect machine isn't the next persons. Everyone has different requirements. I'm not sure about those other machines, but if it's a single boiler forget it. Also single boilers you can't steam and brew at the same time or leave on all day. My machine takes about 15 minutes to get up to temperature, and has a 4lt boiler. Bigger takes longer to heat up but is more temperature stable which is better in my opinon. Get a HX as a minimum.

Moon · October 2013

L. No offence but it doesn't sound like you know what you want. [Werribee] M. Fair call. I'm sure I wouldn't be the only person to have visited this, or other coffee forums in search of information and advice with deciding which equipment to purchase? Keep in mind that I am coming from a low base -- $500 single boiler Gaggia Baby .. and therefore don't necessarily require a $3-4,000 Rocket or Izzo to be totally happy with what I produce in the cup with my next upgrade. L. I think you need to test drive a few machines first. Always good advice I am limited by financial constraints .. so what I need to decide is .. am I going to be happy with the coffee in the cup if I upgrade with what I can I can afford now .. or do I keep saving up for say a Strega further down the track? This .. and every other coffee forum would be filled with people who upgraded gradually rather than taking the huge leap in going from a $200 Breville to a $3,500 Expobar Minore. Does it really matter to me whether a PV Lusso performs less in 'clarity' and 'body' but better in bringing out bright notes in single origin beans .. as well as caramel and chocolate flavors compared to the e61 group machines which maybe better at delivering brighter fruity notes in beans from Yemen? I think not. I have a few more years of development before getting to that point. From a $500 Gaggia Baby and $160 grinder .. any $1.300 machine and $600 grinder combo is guaranteed to blow me away. L. Also single boilers you can't steam and brew at the same time or leave on all day. M. Having a single boiler .. I'm aware of this .. and sofar haven't found waiting 30 seconds to reach steam temp that much of an inconvenience. According to the video from Bezzera .. steam back down to brew temp was even less than 30 secs when flicking the switch and adding cold water from the tank into the boiler. It's not like a Cafe at home where every second counts.. as in time is money. Speakin of money. As for leaving it on all day... perhaps some people have money to burn .. but personally, I find leaving machines on all day when you only have 2-3 coffees a little wasteful at a time when many people are trying to reduce their power bills.. me being one of them .. yep, turn off lights and stand-by on my TV/sound system too. Same goes for a 3 ltr boiler .. what a waste heating that amount of water up for a 30ml shot or 2? .. and then it has to power on every 2-3 mins to maintain the temperature just on the off chance you may want another 30ml shot in the afternoon? Surely this must be wearing out the components of the machine much earlier than they would otherwise wear out if turned off when not being used again within an hour or 2? Admittedly, I'd prefer a larger boiler than 500ml (I think my Baby is only 300ml?) but do I really need it? The milk that Lucy Bezzera whipped up in his Bezzera Unica video looked fine to me .. and didn't seem to take long. He had to bleed a little water from the boiler to create room for the steam .. which is not ideal .. and a mild inconvenience .. only I can live with that ---> first world problem. >:D I do appreciate your comments Lacehim .. fair dinkum. Read your threads/posts around the traps. I'm simply nowhere near your level, and many others here, and on other forums as far as knowledge and coffee appreciation goes .. so unlike you blokes with heaps of experience in the search of the holy grail .. in my case .. and being a latte lover.. I have the bar set much lower and am not seeking perfection .. just a really nice cup of coffee. I feel like I'm currently on rung 2/10 on the ladder atm Rung 3 - Rancilio Silvia and a Rocky grinder Rung 4 - Bezzera Unica with PID Rung 5 - Entry level HX machine Cheers

Lacehim · October 2013

I personally don't see myself as a guru of coffee. I'm just like you, on a journey for the best coffee I can get. My cup is usually a latte too.

Everyone is on their own journey and we all expect different things/experiences from that journey. It's more important to enjoy the journey than to be constantly upgrading and upgrading. Anyway, on to your machine requirements. I would step over the Silvia level if you want to "upgrade". Is the coffee good enough now, or are you looking for more? The Bezzera single boilers are better from my experiences (Kelsey had one) because at least they have low water cut off sensors. The silvia doesn't and it a PITA the change elements over when you burn them out! Are you really wanting new? If money is tight they why not look at pre-loved? As an example, here's a machine, serviced (I know it's not going to suit you, just an example) with a grinder for under $1,000. There are plenty of good machines out there, but you want to avoid anything that needs fixing, has problems, or hasn't been professionally serviced. http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Bezzera-BZ35-DE-Volumetric-Espresso-Coffee-Machine-/261309568794?pt=AU_Business_Industrial_Restaurant_Catering_Equipment&hash=item3cd743971a&_uhb=1 I would have that on my kitchen bench without a drama!

Just to give you an idea my journey has been a Lucy (Siliva/Rocky) which was okay, then a San Marino that I restored which I didn't really like steaming milk on, and then the lusso. I loved the lusso a lot! It's the best machine I've every owned, but quality issues, you know the deal. The current machine is great, but has it's quirks too. I've learned along the way, had fun, and that's more important than having the next $$$ machine on my bench. Now I've given machines away for a while because I need the $$$ and I want to spend some time manual brewing to further learn, and have fun!

I don't think your budget is unreasonable, and with that budget you should be able to get kick ass coffee. IMO spend more on your grinder though, less on the machine!

Moon · October 2013

Howdy I've taken a look at 2nd hand machines on eBay which is where I have purchased my last few machines .. one developing an electrical problem a month after getting it. I'm a bit over pre-loved machines and would like to move on to my first decent newy to look after properly. I've also considered small commercial machines and grinders, and although I admire the build quality .. they are just too big for the home kitchen bench (I can hear wives applauding all over the country) I mean .. to achieve 2-3 quality lattes per day, do I really need to have a huge Mazzer Super Jolly to achieve it.. with say? 65mm grinders to fill a double basket. Is this overkill? Why are commercial machines and grinders built like tanks .. because they have to grind 200+ coffees every day. My average is 2.2. It's like using a sledgehammer to squash a cockroach imo. Is a Macap M2M not good enough? I was originally thinking of a Compak K3 push .. only the Macap was rated comparable to the Mazzer mini .. and the Mazzers .. being commercial .. only come with a doser. Oh .. and the Macap is available in chrome .. which would look better alongside a stainless coffee machine.. even if the wrong shape. Like coffee machines .. how much do you need to pay to achieve the result in the cup that you are after?

Moon · October 2013

Crikey .. I've just been notified that my red Ponte Vecchio Lever will be available at the end of this week from the factory .. and waiting instructions on the order? Do I or don't I ... am I feeling lucky? I'm waiting for a sign from above on whether it will be ok .. or a lemon?

Moon · October 2013

Ok .. I'm taking a leap of Faith and going with my original plan Ponte Vecchio Lusso 1 group in red it is .. now a member of the Lever Club. Fingers crossed .. n all that :P Ahh .. the sign? Just noticed I've been promoted from 'Instant drinker' to 'Junior Barista' That must've been it :thumb:

Lacehim · October 2013

Good luck Moon. It's a capable machine in my opinion. I just hope they have stepped up with the build quality. Let me know when you get it and I'll try and remember a few tips to get you going. Congratulations on the purchase!

Moon · October 2013

Along the lines of prevention being better than cure and from reading about the problems owners have had .. Any thoughts on these measures - after removing casing. * Varnish (estapol) inside casing and perhaps floor as Jack recommended to prevent rust due to humidity and potential water leakage? * Enclose the boiler with Insulbrite and bind with velcro strapping as I read another owner has done. They used a cork sheet as a heat barrier at the end where the electrical wiring is attached to the boiler due to the Insulbrite having a metal component to it. This should prevent heat issues experienced by some whereby the metal casing of the 'brain' was distorted, along with others such as colour changes & plastic components melting close to the boiler. Should these enclosed units have vents on the back or side to allow air circulation to help disperse heat and help clear up any damp issues due to potential water leaks? Just a thought? * Considering the superficial scratches found inside the pistons by a couple of owners experiencing leaking from the groups .. is it worth checking the piston rod seals to see if they have been adequately lubricated in the factory prior to using .. as well as checking for scratches? The fact that the scratching is straight (according to photos) and runs lengthwise in the piston suggests that it may have been caused by inserting the rod incorrectly (perhaps without seals to check fit?), at an angle allowing metal to metal contact, seals too narrow to buffer from metal wall .. or that it wasn't correctly lubricated whereby the seals were compressed too much or slightly dislodged .. once again, allowing for metal to metal contact? It is less likely, but possible .. that this flaw could have occurred during machining of the pistons Of course .. if the 'Quality control' at the factory was of a high standard .. none of this would be necessary. When you purchase a new machine, it should only take filling up the boiler ..plugging it in, and turning it on. Then again, if you want the no fuss .. easy way out .. you wouldn't be getting a Lever machine .. would you?

Lacehim · October 2013

on 1382407273:

* Varnish (estapol) inside casing and perhaps floor as Jack recommended to prevent rust due to humidity and potential water leakage?

Not a bad idea if you want to do it. Mine got a tiny bit of rust in a corner but taking the casing off was a nightmare and I couldn't be bothered.

on 1382407273:

* Enclose the boiler with Insulbrite and bind with velcro strapping as I read another owner has done. They used a cork sheet as a heat barrier at the end where the electrical wiring is attached to the boiler due to the Insulbrite having a metal component to it. This should prevent heat issues experienced by some whereby the metal casing of the 'brain' was distorted, along with others such as colour changes & plastic components melting close to the boiler.

Yes!!!! My brain unit got distorted (it's on the left hand side behind the steam arm. So even if you jamb some insulbrite in there to give it some protection it would be worth it.

on 1382407273:

Should these enclosed units have vents on the back or side to allow air circulation to help disperse heat and help clear up any damp issues due to potential water leaks? Just a thought?

It's only a small brain unit, just insulate it and don't stress about it. They can be bypassed and only protect the element from damage, and if you are careful you'll use the sight glass anyway. I only tripped mine once!

on 1382407273:

* Considering the superficial scratches found inside the pistons by a couple of owners experiencing leaking from the groups .. is it worth checking the piston rod seals to see if they have been adequately lubricated in the factory prior to using .. as well as checking for scratches? The fact that the scratching is straight (according to photos) and runs lengthwise in the piston suggests that it may have been caused by inserting the rod incorrectly (perhaps without seals to check fit?), at an angle allowing metal to metal contact, seals too narrow to buffer from metal wall .. or that it wasn't correctly lubricated whereby the seals were compressed too much or slightly dislodged .. once again, allowing for metal to metal contact?

Don't go there, just use it! how would you know that by checking the seals that you caused the damage? IMO insulate the brains box, fill it with water, and use it. If later you want to add an antivac go ahead. Doesn't hurt!

on 1382407273:

Then again, if you want the no fuss .. easy way out .. you wouldn't be getting a Lever machine .. would you?

Who said that? Lever machine have less electical parts (ie solenoids etc) and IMO are less prone to problems. The lusso just has bad quality control, but you already knew that. There are plenty of happy users out there though! Changing seals in my commercial lever would very very easy, just 4 bolts, pull out the lever and piston, change seals and put back in! Easy.

conikal · October 2013

on 1382352187:

Ponte Vecchio Lusso 1 group in red it is .. now a member of the Lever Club. Fingers crossed .. n all that :P

I realize this advice is a little late but... The one bit of advice that a Lusso user gave a while back was to simply get the 2 group m/c... ..because you know that eventually there will be problems with group seals, pistons etc, and you will always have a "spare " group available on standby for when it happens. Sorry !

Moon · October 2013

No worries conikal .. besides the look of 2 groups, and being able to do 2 at the same time .. having the spare in case something goes wrong with one was one of the reasons why I originally wanted the 2 group. I changed back to the 1 group due to thinking having the 2 was a bit of a luxury as I don't need to do multiples cause, unfortunately, I don't have groups of people visiting me who are into coffee .. a bar fridge would be a better investment on that score. ::) The main reason why I decided on the single group was to keep the cost down .. as It can be imported for under the import tax/GST threshold of $1,000. This enables me to get a better grinder. Priorities :P *Neither the PV Lusso or grinder I want are currently available in Australia. Sorry Oz retailers --> get with the groove! I will be ordering the Macap M2D grinder as soon as the Lusso arrives. Apparently, both items rocking up at customs at the same time is not a good thing. 8) Lacehim looks like it was your posted pic I was referring to with the brain casing distortion. See .. I have read them. Also read the one about the brain bypass as well.. no brainer gags.. lol. Handy info. These forums are great! L. Who said that? Lever machine have less electical parts (ie solenoids etc) and IMO are less prone to problems. Me .. only hopefully I'm wrong. What you say is all a part of the sales pitch which had me lusting for a Lusso, believing they were virtually bulletproof .. that is, until you read the threads on forums regarding problems people are having with their Lussos. I'm aware to not get too put off by a few owners having problems and posting about it .. believing that negative experiences are far more likely to make it into threads than positive ones.. only in the case of the Lusso .. Jack has been the only one selling them in Oz, and taking a punt that he hasn't sold hundreds of Lussos .. the problem cases seem to be proportionately high? Unfortunately, I haven't read many cases of .. 'my Lusso is great .. and has never been a problem' I started Jacks old thread over yonder .. asking for an update on how Lusso owners are going these days with their machines? It's been a few weeks and not a single reply.. so does this mean they are running beautifully, sold, or packed away after being replaced due to .. whatever? I guess I'm the next generation .. or victim? .. of poor quality control, or .. the beneficiary of improvements in design and quality control? That is the $1,000 question :question: C'mon Ponte Vecchio .. make my day 8)

Moon · October 2013

Hi ash Thanks for the offer .. sounds good, only you are a day too late. I confirmed my order yesterday and paid this morning Thanks anyway Moon

Moon · October 2013

Ok .. got the coffee machine sorted Now for a compatible grinder? I'm thinking 1, MACAP M2M - 150W - 50mm burrs 2. COMPAK Push - 250W - 58mm burrs Commercial sized machines are overkill imo. * Latte drinker .. so not after the God shot espresso. M4D <--- $1,100 .. *forget it... at this stage anyway Would like a grinder that could handle an upgrade down the track though .. say a *Strega ..for example? Any thoughts on either of these .. or as good or better around that price range $450-$550 -->tops!! * Probably where the grinder upgrade to a Macap M4D kicks in .. lotsa cash to flash??

Koffee_Kosmo · October 2013

Get a manual grinder like the Pharos :thumb:

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